With the trade deadline now less than three weeks away — Feb. 27, to be specific — talks between general managers figure to increase in intensity and frequency by the day. Dean Lombardi’s standard pose these days is some variation of standing with his Blackberry to his ear. Will any of those talks involve Jonathan Bernier? It’s a tough situation for the Kings. Bernier and Jonathan Quick are both under contract for one more season — Quick will be an unrestricted free agent in 2013; Bernier a restricted free agent — and Quick has established himself as one of the NHL’s top goalies. Bernier is well-regarded and plenty of teams need goalie help. But is it that simple?
First, what would Bernier’s value be? It’s probably higher among those who follow the Kings regularly, who (in large number, at least) believe that Bernier has the potential to be a No. 1 goalie. On the base level, though, Bernier is a 23-year-old goalie with only 42 games of NHL experience. No team will give up the farm to get him, and the Kings are highly unlikely to simply take draft picks for Bernier. And what about contracts? Would the Kings trade Bernier before Quick is locked up to a long-term deal? The nightmare scenario for the Kings would be to trade Bernier, then have Quick walk next summer.
Asked about Bernier, in the context of the trade deadline, Lombardi would only say, “I understand the value of having two strong goalies.’’ So, take that for whatever you think it’s worth.
In general trade-deadline chatter, Kevin Allen of USA Today had a nice piece today about deadline deals, and how the breathless, endless chatter can lead to trouble for teams. Or, as Toronto GM Brian Burke put it, “The trade deadline is a pit of quicksand.’’
Thank you Rich! I knew he doesn’t go anywhere….
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alex101 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:56 pm
@outsider, I would trade Doughty. The kid isn’t as good as he is hyped up to be. He still has a big name and we still have depth at D. I see him turn the puck over and make stupid mistakes more then anyone. He has slumped 2 years now and he has a 7 million dollar hit. Thats just me. Package Bernier and Doughty throw in some picks and you could get probably 2 or 3 solid players to re-frame this god- awful, pathetic scoring. In the meantime do not resign Penner next year and put Gagne on IR.
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dahack11 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 7:10 pm
@alex101, I’d keep both goalies & trade DD> He’d bring a GREAT return alone & we’d be free of his 7 mil. cap hit. He just isn’t worth it & I’m now certain he never will be.
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AZ King Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:23 pm
@dahack11,
You’re certain that he will never be great. OMG I’ve never read anything more ridiculous. The kids 22 years old, and he’s already an impact player in the league.
alex101 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 10:19 pm
@dahack11, we will be the ones saying I told you so. He needs to come back down to earth a little bit, and start focusing on the game. He’s just not that good.
dahack11 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 10:24 pm
@dahack11, No he’s not an impact player. Talk about sounding ridiculous. Check his #’s….then check his salary. Are they equal? Are they close to being equal? Are they ANYWHERE close to being equal??? His #’s equate to being paid 2 million. This team could sure use that extra 5 million to get a scorer.
And yes, I’m certain that DD is nothing more than very skilled hockey player trapped in the fat, lazy body, of a spoiled punk.
AZ King Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:39 am
@dahack11,
No they’re not equal. I said on another post, Drew is still 2-3 years away from being worth how much he is being paid. I’m sorry that your angry and bitter about that, but that’s the business of hockey. DL paid fro Drew’s potential, which by all accounts is tremendous. The kid was a Norris Trophy finalist at 20 years old, he had a major part in Canada winning the gold medal, and yes he is an impact player when he’s on his game. Expecting him to be on his game every game, at 22 years old, is unrealistic. No one is on their game all the time. All these comments about him being a “fat, lazy, spoiled punk” are ridiculous, and tells me that you took the whole contract thing personal. Well get over yourself, it wasn’t personal, it was business.
dahack11 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:56 am
@dahack11, So if he was so great at 20, which he was, why not now at 22? And I don’t care what age someone is, for 7 million, they SHOULD be on their game. Enough w/ the excuses. The kid ain’t performing period.
It confirms that he is a fat lazy punk. And, no, it’s not personal w/ me, but it is w/ you b/c you continue to stick up for him despite his #’s.
And I’ll say it…..one more time…..we need that 5 million being overspent on him for scoring help this season & next, & the next after that. Who cares about what DD “may” become in 2016? This whole team will be different then.
He’s overpaid, & overpaid A LOT. Those are facts I’m talking about.
stilts19 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 10:40 am
@dahack11, KEEP Voynov, trade either DD or JJ. Zatkoff can become a back-up goalie. PAY Quick the money to be our long term #1 goalie. Dump Penner or re-sign him to the bare minimum (with incentives for goals, which would pay him more). What about MR??? He is woefully inconsistent in scoring. Brown. Should we trade him and make this Kopi and MR’s team? Too many “leaders” maybe? Do we need a clear #1 guy to lead? Something has to give…
Duckbasher Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 11:07 am
@dahack11,
I couldn’t agree with you more. Doughty obviously peaked at 19. And yes I do hold a grudge against him. He was signed as an LA king and was given the opportunity to play big minutes at the age of 18. It’s those big minutes that afforded him the opportunity to put up better numbers than if he’d been playing only 10-12 minutes a game. Even worse… he could have been held back in juniors like Schenn was. What would his value have been then? If you ask me, I think he owed the Kings some sort of compensation for the opportunity they gave him. But NO… he HELD THE KING’s up for ransom.
If my son was given that opportunity by someone (Dean Lombardi) and then treated them the way he did just so his ego could be stroked by the fact that he is a team’s highest paid player… I’d kick his behind. Drew Doughty is like a cancer on this team. And it needs to be removed before it infects those around him. Maybe it already has?
Jose Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:56 pm
@alex101, why don’t u throw in a couple of number 1 picks while ur at it! Too Funny!
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5holer Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:23 pm
@alex101, I have a single word response to this(a first in life for me!)…ASSININE!
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McSorleyfan Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:28 am
@5holer, ^5. The things they think are useless, I can’t understand.
King Cobra Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:29 am
@alex101, Amen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Weasel Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 11:12 am
@alex101,
I understand the frustration. But I can’t see trading Doughty as anything but a huge mistake. However, I will grant that he hasn’t earned his $7 mil this season.
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@arman Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:08 pm
@Weasel, leave DD alone,he works his but off night in night out, u people clearly don’t appreciate him for what he does for this team. Its not just about points, its about hustle, defense, shots, plays, and a lot of other things. What about when he scored with .4 seconds left on the clock, huh, did u people forget about
that??????????????????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
JD Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 1:17 am
@outsider, I would think just letting the kid sit and rot on the bench has killed any trade value he had. Nice job to Murray and sutter, way to use your assets. DL should be held accountable for the total misuse of the young players on his watch.
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PaulHB Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 5:47 am
@JD, So you would sit a guy who is putting up a Vezina worthy season in favor of a guy with 42 NHL games just to pump up the latter’s trade value? If the Kings were in Columbus’ position in the standings I could MAYBE see it. But they’re fighting for a playoff spot. You play the better goalie, which right now is clearly Quick.
And to all the people suggesting to trade JJ or Doughty, you all need to seek some professional counseling. To even write those ludicrous suggestions in a post shows that you guys know nothing about hockey. JJ & Doughty are the Kings 2 best defensemen and both are young. If Dean Lombardi traded either he should be fired on the spot unless he got someone like Malkin or Stamkos in return.
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King Cobra Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:33 am
@PaulHB, Trade Nash for Doubty NOW.
Duckbasher Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 11:11 am
@PaulHB,
Doughty gets worked by the opposing team more than a Las Vegas hooker at Wall Street Hedge Fund convention.
JD Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 7:19 pm
@PaulHB, I’m not saying to sit quick, but you don’t need to play quick every game, give quick enough nights off to keep him rested for late in the season, and maybe even playoffs, plus you keep bernier playing at a higher level, which helps the team both on the ice, and during any trade negotiations. Maybe DL and DS should use Boston as a example, keeping Thomas fresh seemed to work out for them
I also agree 100% on doughty and Johnson, the doughty hate is just a few bitter guys, that post the same nonsense every day
stilts19 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 10:47 am
@JD, Yeah, the poor kid plays good hockey, let’s in 2 goals or less and still LOSES! These guys ALWAYS seem to play like crap with him in net! This HAS to be killing his confidence….
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Bama Kings Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 6:03 am
@outsider, After reading most of the comments, it’s clear there is a lot of LA bias in our trade ideas. We hype up out players like everyone else does and that is why I think deals rarely please fans. UFA’s are easier for us to stomach.
Truth is this… can the team with this year? If so, then you can risk. Losing Bernier, who IS and UNPROVEN goalie is risky as it leaves us in a situation where Quick could put a dagger in the teams heart by walking away next summer.
If you lock up Quick, then Bernier is expendable, so long as we get back some kind of back-up in return.
But the return for Bernier isn’t going to be something that makes people happy on this blog. You have to package him with another player and or picks. We’re pretty much out of valuable picks, minus our first round, right?
You can move a bunch of middle level guys, but you’re not going to fill the hole you’re creating.
This leaves you with moving one of our big assets: Kopitar, Brown, Williams, RIchards, Doughty, JJ.
So, we are left to ask another question, do we want a real return? If so, do we want a real return without creating a hole?
The only person on that list of players who will fetch a big return and NOT leave a major hole is DD.
I’m am NOT saying he isn’t an impact player, look at his minutes. He is a very valuable player to us and has picked his game up of late. However, he isn’t Lidstrom. Could he be one day? Sure. But anyone who has read and hated my comments before knows I think you risk what could be for what is.
DD’s stock has dropped. If we moved him last year (summer) his value would have been Nash, Vanek etc. straight up.
Now, you probably have to add a pick or a prospect to DD to get that return. (Parise) To get Parise (only if agreed to a contract) you might have to give up DD and Bernier.
DD is only a “King” here in LA. Everywhere else, he’s an over paid guy who has big upside.
If you move DD and bring back a legit scorrer, this team is in a better place. Our structure and our depth is deffensive in nature. We can move DD and be just fine.
Don’t respond to this as I’m hating on Drew. There is nothing I’ve said here that isn’t 100% true. IF we can’t get a decent return on DD, then we shouldn’t move him… stock up for next year and take a run at the UFA this summer.
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bfstyle33 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:44 am
@Bama Kings, I agree with you regarding Quick. We need to lock him up before we decide what to do with Bernier.
As for DD, you got it all backwards. Outside of LA, DD is coveted by alot of teams. Only here on this blog are there a lot of DD haters….for what? He held out because that is his right as a player? He got what he asked for in $7mil. He didn’t break any rules….it is his right to do what he did. You put DD on the trading block and I guarantee you..you won’t hear anyone outside of LA saying that the $7mil price tag on him will be hard for him to be moved. Lombardi’s phone will not stop ringing if he were to do that.
DD missed training camp etc… and yet he is still our best defenseman out there. Yes…he could be better and he will get better. We trade him and I’ll even add JJ on this, if we trade anyone of those we will regret it for a long time. This franchise needs to stick to their players and let them develop. Look at what happened to Moulson, Purcell etc… Let these YOUNG guys figure it out…patience instead of trading or getting help from another team. Last I looked, we arent very sucessfull in those areas as well. Had we kept Moulson, signed him to a 1 year deal back then when…who knows he could have been the LW that we are in such a need for right now.
Let DD continue his development. Same with JJ, Loktionov etc…
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MindGeyser Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 10:45 am
@Bama Kings, That is the best, and in my opinion only, argument for moving Drew Doughty. My contention is that we really don’t want to do it, because the odds of him reaching something close to his tremendous upside are excellent, and his cap hit will continue to be a lessening burden on the team as the contract and his play both mature, like Mike Richards’ deal.
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Duckbasher Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 11:30 am
@Bama Kings,
VERY well stated. Honestly, I’m beginng to think that LA trading for any players to fill a long-term position isn’t a great idea. UFA signings and drafting is the place to fill our core from. When a UFA signs with us that means they wanted to be here. They weren’t just “sent” here. We traded some very valuable assets for Mike Richards and I suspect it won’t be long until his “frustration” has him asking to be traded. And just what will we get “if” that happens for him? Maybe Ethan Moreau?
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Dl next move is long overdue…..done nothing to replace parse/gagne/moreau….i wish i had a job and did nothing…….even replacing tm wasnt his move….p.s. i heard from a reliable source it was luc as much as tim
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pesus Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 10:57 am
@neil,
yup, thats why he had to fly to boston to do it.
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Okay, maybe I am not understanding the salary cap correctly. CapGeekk says we have about $800K of cap space. Bernier makes $1,2M Trade him and we can spend $2M. Who we gonna get for $2M that is going to make us a lot better?
We are kinda stuck unless we offload a bigger salary. I think JJ (unless he cant be traded) is expendable because we have Voynov/Martinez/Drewiski in a rotation. All three are NHL level with Voynov and Martinez playing very well. Is Gagne part of the cap? Are we stuck with his salary this year.
I just dont see how this team has any room to manuever. I think we are stuck with the roster as is.
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loskingpride Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:15 pm
@UglyinLA, Last time I checked, Gagne was still going against our cap until he is placed on LTIR. We can always get rid of Penner for a bag of pucks from Winnipeg and oh look another 4M in the bank for us, I believe he’s around 4M anyways.
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ValleyKingsFan Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:15 pm
@UglyinLA, Gagne can go on long term injured reserve, taking some of his cap hit with him. One reason Stoll is on the block is to offload salary. If we trade Stoll, a large chunk of space opens up.
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KingsFanFTW Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:18 pm
@UglyinLA, could trade Stoll Bernier and maybe Martinez in could make a 1,3M…Stoll about 3,6M and Martinez 735,500 so equal just about to 5,6M Space….
Could be a pretty decent player…
That if Stoll and Bernier are the one that gets traded.
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Dave Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:53 pm
@UglyinLA, you only have to account for the remaining part of the cap hit. so with about 1/3 of the season left, you only need 1/3 the cap space of the cap hit you acquire. not to mention if DL makes a deal for a top-6 he would likely put Gagne on LTIR if he doesn’t move a contract.
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quisp Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 7:56 pm
@UglyinLA,
You are right. In order to bring in someone big, they will have to move salary. as far as Gagne is concerned, injured players always count against the cap, BUT teams are allowed to exceed the cap by up to the cap hit of the injured player to “replace” the injured player. The problem with that is, you can’t keep a player on IR if they aren’t injured. So they have to be sure gagne is done for the year before they count on that cap relief (i.e. replacement money).
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King Cobra Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:37 am
@quisp, Gagne is an over cooked steak, he is DONE!
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MindGeyser Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:46 pm
@UglyinLA, Johnson is not expendable, neither can bang bodies and score like he can. The Kings have Willie Mitchell at a discount, so don’t assume he’ll be there to hold the fort even if Johnson is gone.
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i dont see Bernier going anywhere into Quick gets a long term contract..
But then again i never seen Scheen and Simmonds get traded and they did..
All we know he could be trading Quick away….Not saying he is…
If Dl does i hope he gets someone that able to score goals or at least be a threat and a very good partner with Richards or Kopi.
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KingsFanFTW Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:19 pm
@KingsFanFTW, Schenn*
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puck73 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:48 pm
@KingsFanFTW, Agree.
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Gustavo Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:32 pm
@KingsFanFTW,
If DL trades Quick, this team’s morale will go to hell in a hand basket and we’ll all be looking to be fans of another team until he gets fired.
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Who was that team we traded with for “future considerations”, where we took a player to offload some cap space for that team. was it Philly?
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CB14 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:25 pm
@Lake Forest, Yup
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Bernier would be a good fit in New Jersey.
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Niko Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:30 pm
@Sam,
Parise (signed), would be a good fit in LA
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Kingsfanone Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:50 pm
@Niko,
If we trade Bernier to NJ, we better be getting a signed Parise, nothing less.
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Niko Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:08 pm
@Kingsfanone,
agree 100%
number 6 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:35 pm
@Kingsfanone, Sam and Niko
I live back east and follow NJ a bit. Lou has them in playoff position. He isn’t gonna trade Parise at this point. It’s just that simple. And he’s gonna try and work out something to be able to keep him.
Yes, I know that even Gretzky was traded. But Peter Pocklington and Lou Lamoriello are two very very different people.
Duncanz Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 7:50 pm
@number 6, … and then there’s the sexy-domineering-wife-with-the-hollywood-aspirations clause, a la Gretzky, David Beckham, etc.
With respect to this, anyone know the status on Mrs Parise?
Bama Kings Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 6:06 am
@Kingsfanone, LOL… I can’t believe you put them on the same level. It will cost us much more than Bernier.
Off topic…..Could someone please explain to me why Ryan Smyth demanded a trade to Edmonton last summer?
http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news;_ylt=AoucojEiXW6pIVIgGn8vBeJ7vLYF?slug=nc-trade-deadline-oilers-ryan-smyth-020812
If he’s traded to a contending team later this month, something is rotten in Denmark not to mention Manhattan Beach & Edmonton!
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CB14 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:38 pm
@Rainman, Mabye his problem was with TM, not LA.
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Poorman Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:49 pm
@Rainman, Great point. They should have kept him. Lombardi strikes again. Smyth for Fraser?
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Kingsfanone Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:52 pm
@Poorman,
Don’t think the Kings can afford Richards here if Smyth isn’t gone.
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Poorman Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:56 pm
@Kingsfanone, That even would have been more the reason to keep Smyth. Then the Kings wouls still have Simmonds and Schenn and Smyth.
Kingsfanone Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:26 pm
@Poorman,
Smyth wanted a trade to a specific team(s). DL accommodated him. No choice.
Rainman Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 7:26 pm
@Kingsfanone, Richards was acquired via trade on June 23rd. Smyth wasn’t traded for Colin Fraser until June 26th. Perhaps the Kings knew that Smyth was on his way out, but the fact remains that Richards was acquired before Smyth was dealt to the Oilers.
Duckbasher Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 11:34 am
@Kingsfanone,
You mean they couldn’t afford to overpay Doughty… right?
What's the frequency, Kenneth? Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:52 pm
@Rainman, I saw the article, and…EXPLETIVE! EXPLETIVE, EXPLETIVE-EXPLETIVE EXPLETIVE!
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Christian T Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 7:43 pm
@Rainman, There is a chance Smyth could be traded but it is quite obvious that he does not want to be traded. If the Oilers asked him to waive his no trade clause then he might say OK but otherwise every word he has said about the rumors is that he doesn’t want to be traded. Dl’s Smyth trade helped both the Kings and Smyth. The only reason it seems bad is because we can’t score. Otherwise we would have been over the cap and the beginning of the season.
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jofa6000 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 1:13 am
@Christian T, smyth also stated he didnt want to be traded from l.a. during the summer and he lied/bs’d cz we now know he wanted out.
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Duckbasher Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 11:38 am
@Christian T,
Not if we told DD to feel free to sit this one out. If the King’s had Smyth’s 16 goals and Simmonds 18 goals they’d be leading the west.
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No.
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tornado12 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:46 pm
@Dominick, it better be…
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I have a feeling based on the limited $ to spend and the goalie situation we wont be getting any major trades done.
The team we have now is the team that is going to need to get the job done.
I, for one, believe this team will have success with the current roster. Honestly,I dont put much stock i a SC, but I certainly would not be surprised to see this current team to make it to the Confrence Final. I think Van or Det’s experience in that pressure series wins. But I really believe the Kings can make it that far. They are beging to gel, they are starting to show confidence, they obviously believe in and are motivated by DS. AND, the experience or the last two years playoffs will give them the confidence to carry them the first to rounds.
My thought.
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g smith86 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:54 pm
@Lead Feet, I too believe that all it takes is for them to get there…they will not be a fun team to play come playoff time…and that goes for any team
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Niko Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:12 pm
@g smith86,
Very true. If they make it to the big show, I like their chances a lot more with Sutter at the helm. I just get the feeling he will know how to out coach the other team and get the most out of his guys. The playoffs are a completely different game, one that the Kings are suited for imo.
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rogiesbackup Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:55 am
@Niko, Yup, me too. Seems come play-offs the Kings always do a 180. All of sudden they’re scoring bunch of goals and they’re PP comes to life.
If I was DL I’d keep away from too many transactions until DS has more time to spend on the offense system this summer.
Kopi Bryant Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:38 pm
@g smith86, Exactly what I think
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I still think that Jeff Carter will be the only regularly 30+ goal scorer moved before the trade deadline. He works well with Richards, so I think that is the only real big impact guy the Kings can get. I think if we can trade for Jussi Jolkinen that would improve our regular season roster greatly(Shootout Ace, 52+ in faceoffs Lefty) and make a modest playoff addition. I was eying Frans Nielson for the same reason as Jolkinen, but NYI just signed him to a 4 year extention so I doubt he will be moved.
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g smith86 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:55 pm
@luc20rules, Jeff Carter?…again…this guy is great when he is in the ozone with room and is healthy…how often has that happened over the past three seasons?
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luc20rules Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:59 pm
@g smith86, This will be Carters 7th year other than this year and the 2006-7 year in which he missed 20 games he has missed less than 8 games/year.
@number 6 if his D is so terrible how does he have a +/- of +43 in his career?
I am just stating thats likely to be the best player AVAILABLE, not that exists. I think it is a risk especially with the long contract, but that long contract could be a bargain if he continues to produce now thru the next 7 years. Below the link with his stats.
http://espn.go.com/nhl/player/stats/_/id/2383/jeff-carter
I would really like to get Jolkinen as he is only a 3mil/yr cap hit for 2 more years and should also be reasonably in expensive assets wise.
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number 6 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:38 pm
@luc20rules,
Bad idea. Trust me. It’s a bad idea. There were reasons why Richards and Carter were shipped out of Philly. Even if teh press reports were exaggerated. I’ve heard too many hockey pundits question Carter’s work ethic and he’s not performed well in the playoffs from what I hear.
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variable Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:21 pm
@luc20rules,
carter creates salary cap problems down the line…
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We can’t trade Bernier before Quick is signed; the downside is simply too great.
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Kings Fan South Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 5:28 am
@Jon G, Agreed!
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as Toronto GM Brian Burke put it, “The trade deadline is a pit of quicksand.’’ Listen to the words of a good GM. On his way out the door, I hope Lombardi doesn’t make yet another hideous trade by getting rid of Bernier. That would be the topper Kings Fans. This GM should be traded for a bag of pucks if anybody should. How many chances does he get to get it right AEG. At this point, at least a dozen: 3 Coaches, 5 Bad trades, 4 poor free agent signings. But then this is all part of his 5 year plan, remember. Oh, wait a minute. This is year 6. Oh, OK. What’s another couple years of underperformance to the LA Kings anyhow.
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Kingsfanone Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:03 pm
@Poorman,
Burke may be in a more tenable situation than Lombardi. If he’s a “good GM” as you say, how come he doesn’t have a Cup team there yet?
When you heard DL talk at the Breakfasts with the GM, you of course heard him say minimum of 6 years, not 5.
Cmon dude, stop pushing the panic button so easily. You cry wolf too many times and people stop listening. Kinda like radio.
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Poorman Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:20 pm
@Kingsfanone, Now that’s a low blow, but regarding radio, you are correct and a winner of…nothing! I can’t get a radio gig if my life depended on it. But you can check my live streaming 24/7 show Poorman’s Nation now. You can see it snowing outside my window http://www.Stickam.com/PoormansNation .
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Kingsfanone Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:53 pm
@Poorman,
As for a radio gig, stop crying wolf. Be like Howard Stern, who is the wolf! Corporate doesn’t want a guy from the 80′s, they want a guy that has substance. That’ll get you further with the suits. Play a game they can be comfortable supporting.
Duncanz Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:18 pm
@Poorman, Ha ha, great! Always self-effacing and at the same time never missing a chance of self-promoting!
@kingsfanone, There’s only one Howard Stern … but then, there’s only one Poorman also!
number 6 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:44 pm
@Kingsfanone,
As for Burke…. A) He won the Stanley Cup with the Ducks. B) He made very bold moves that most didn’t agree with in Toronto – specifically what he gave up for Phil Kessel…., and he’s managed to put together a lethal and Fast first line in this his third season there.
I don’t like going off on DL, but as I’ve documented here. there are aspects of his approach that don’t wash with me. Going on year six and the first line isn’t even a legit first line. And two thirds of it (Kopi and Brownie) were already here. Other than JW he hasn’t added one single impact winger in six years. So careful what you say about Burke.
Also, Burke managed at the same time to find good goaltending And trade for Dion Phaneuf and only one team got the good part of that deal. Our coach was at the time the GM of the Flames. Thank God he’s a coach and not a GM.
[Reply]
Osaka Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 10:40 pm
@Kingsfanone, To be fair Burke is a great GM. He built and won the cup in Anaheim, built the current team in Vancouver, and turned around Toronto. I am not saying who is bad or who is good as a GM other than Burke, he is quality.
[Reply]
g smith86 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:04 pm
@Poorman, The only way DL keeps his job is if the players he signed over the last couple of years start to perform…DP and MR got to put the puck in the net…period! We know what we are getting with fraser, but Hunter was an experiment that has gone wrong…so DL s track record is not looking good this year…Losing Smythe and hoping Gagne picks up the slack…that didn’t work and now he’s pretty much lost for the season…Simmonds is seeing time on the PP in Philly and has like 17 or 18 goals…that’s more than MR and now Schenn is starting to find form…this trade will have to be evaluated down the line, but right now it is favoring Philly…if these acquisitions don’t pick up their play and perform then it will be very hard for the Kings to make the playoffs…and if they make the playoffs and are one and done then I don’t see how the GM keeps his job when the “time is supposedly now”
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luc20rules Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 7:13 pm
@g smith86, I understand what you are saying, but there is a huge system difference between Philly & LA. I would expect the same player in Philly to have a increase in goals and assists in a offensive system. I think the fairest way to look at it is +/- on the players. Simmonds -5, Schenn -4 = -9 verse Richards +3.
As for Smyth the guy told DL that he wanted/needed to move to the Edm or Calgary area.
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Kenny44 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:21 pm
@luc20rules, Wait, I thought we were Philly West? But seriously, the system is a DL creation. Saying the system impairs players’ performance does not absolve DL.
As for Smyth, DL could’ve said I’ll check what’s available. But the answer should have been NFW for what we got. Don’t forget the Kovalchuk fiasco and the big whiff on Brad Richards.
At this point, DL’s primary accomplishment is consecutive 1st round playoff exits, and we don’t appear to be on a positive trajectory right now. I really hope things turn our way, but hope is not a plan.
Kenny44 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:24 pm
@luc20rules, And one more thing: what type of example did it set when DL just rolled over for Smyth?
Ever wonder if that whole episode emboldened DD’s agent a little bit? And getting away with I’m not happy so YOU have to change something is not a healthy player-management dynamic.
g smith86 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:55 pm
@luc20rules, ok…got me there, but you know that Simmonds’ game is much more than goal scoring and the effect he would have making a big play or big hit or do whatever it took to get his team going…I haven’t seen that out of MR too much this year…early on, MR was looking great, but of late the impact just hasn’t been there…and as for Schenn, that is a wait to see kind of thing
Duncanz Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:55 pm
@Kenny44, Seriously, someone had to go in there and shake up that locker room when he did.
How would you feel if you’d staked so much on a project and a lot of the people you’d hired were letting the whole thing sink?
As a fan, I was pleased he did that. If our guys have character (and I believe they do), they’ll take their lumps like professionals and learn from that.
Jimmyo777 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 7:53 pm
@Poorman, Brian Burke = a Good GM ????????? What’s he done that hasen’t been handed to on a platter Zilch
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Hypothetically, if Quick could be signed to a long-term deal now, are there ways to deal with the salary cap issues now to make that happen. Hard to make the right long-term moves without knowing where we stand with Quick.
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CB14 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:48 pm
@JackKent Cooke, I’m not 100% sure about this, but I believe that Quick can’t sign an extension until the off-season.
When/if he does sign an extension this off-season, it wouldn’t impact the salary cap next year because he already has a contract for next year with a cap hit of just under 2 million. Either way he’s going to be close to a 7 million dollar cap hit.
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Dave Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:56 pm
@CB14, if he is close to $7M cap hit, Bernier stays and Quick is traded in the offseason. but i think Quick is more likely looking at $4-$5M cap hit.
i don’t believe the cap will be jumping as much as it has been which will start to bring salaries down a bit.
[Reply]
CB14 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:09 pm
@Dave, 4-5, No way that happens. Quick is going to be a Norris finalist this year and is second in the league in GAA and Save% (among goalies with 30+ starts) behind Henrik Lundqvist in both categories. Lundqvist’s cap hit is 6.875 . Pekka Rinna was a Norris finalist last year and he recently signed a 7 year deal worth 7 million per year. How do you think Quick is only going to get 4-5 mil per year? Even if salaries do go down, he won’t get less than 6 mil per year.
We finally got an All Star goalie and you think we should get rid of him if he gets paid what he rightfully deserves? I completly disagree with you on that one.
Niko Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:17 pm
@Dave,
Vezina?
I agree though, Quick is becoming the face of this franchise, pay him what he deserves DL
JackKent Cooke Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:19 pm
@Dave,
To further put the salary issue in perspective, Quick is more valuable to the Kings that Kopitar or Doughty.
Dave Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:20 pm
@CB14 – how many playoff rounds has Quick won?
CB14 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:27 pm
@Niko, Brain lapse on my part.
@JackKent Cooke, I agree. DD has a 7 mil cap hit, Kopi a 6.8 cap hit. Thus Quick should be right there with both of those guys.
@Dave, The same as Kopi and Doughty, 0. But I don’s see you saying they should be traded.
luc20rules Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 7:18 pm
@Dave, I like Bernier, but honestly if Quick was not in goal as for us this year Kings would be around 18-32-4 this year.
Dave Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 10:10 pm
@CB14 – actually, i would be all for trading Doughty.
Dominick Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:41 pm
@JackKent Cooke, Per NHL rules, you can’t start negitiations on extending a contract till the final season of the existing contract. Next season at the ealriest.
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JackKent Cooke Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:00 pm
@Dominick,
Thanks. Guess I’ll keep my day job.
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Not really seeing a lot of options for the Kings this season. Our cap situation, plus the lack of sellers, means our best move may be to just stand pat.
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Kingsfanone Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:07 pm
@LomitaKingsFan,
I think Lombardi can try and find a filler for Gagne, but a superstar may be out of the question.
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luc20rules Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 7:20 pm
@Kingsfanone, Thats what I have been saying and been getting ripped a new one. Each time I throw a name out there.
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variable Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:19 pm
@LomitaKingsFan,
that is a very likely scenario…but i do think deano tries to get some ancillary help…
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Alex Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:09 pm
@variable, Van Riemsdyk is available. And i do not think it will take too much to get him…JJ????? And he is a very good young forward. It’s a start.
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If the Kings can get a legit top 6 winger for Bernier, I say go for it! Otherwise it makes no sense. More likely, I see the Kings trading Martinez, Voynov or even Johnson for an up and coming scoring winger on some team that’s stacked at Forward like the Kings are stacked on Defense. This kind of trade would help both teams, so makes sense to me.
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tornado12 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:54 pm
@LB, tading voynov is premature and trading JJ is just plain (insert vernacular). Like DL says, the trade deadline hardly ever puts your team over the top and the return is never as good as it would be at any other time of the year. We got what we got here people. Lets get behind our boys and hope they start playing to their potential. If anything maybe something minor (prospect/picks) for a rental player (the wizard)!
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Dave Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:57 pm
@tornado12, normally i’d agree, but in the case of Jeff Carter, the price may never be lower. that’s the one guy that if you are going to make a move, you make the move now.
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Poorman Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:06 pm
@Dave, Terrible move.
Dave Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:21 pm
@Poorman – yes, you are right. there is no way this team could use a 30 goal scorer.
tornado12 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:56 pm
@Dave, what about that cap hit and length?
Dave Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 10:12 pm
@Dave, the cap hit is fine. $5.2M for a 30 goal scorer is a bargain. i don’t love the length but Carter is the type of player that should be good into his late 30s. he’s a skill guy that doesn’t score most of his goals from in front of the net, so he should be good for a while.
LB Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:04 pm
@tornado12,
I’d love to “hope they start playing to their potential” but do you really think this team that’s been last in scoring all season will miraculously start scoring more goals without any aditions to the roster?
[Reply]
Poorman Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:07 pm
@LB, Agree with you exactly. GM is the problem. Can’t emphasize it enough.
tornado12 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 7:05 pm
@LB, thats the beauty of sports. stats are just stats. they cant predict the future
luc20rules Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 7:26 pm
@LB, Boston traded away Kessel, drafted Tyler Seguin 2nd overall it was just 2 years before they won the cup. If there was no salary cap there is no telling how strong that trade would make Boston.
Cruiznblue Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:36 pm
@tornado12,
Actually a lot of trades last year at the deadline were positives for teams involved and had an impact. Just cause you trade doesn’t mean youre guaranteed ti win the cup…but it can make an impact! DL is blowing smoke.
[Reply]
tornado12 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:54 pm
@Cruiznblue, which trade did boston make to win the cup?
jacky boy Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:43 pm
@Cruiznblue, The Kings should trade for Carter. Maybe Bernier and Penner for Carter… With the expiring contracts of Stoll, Penner, Greene, and Mitchell. The Kings have enough cap space (I think 13.8M) to sign quick (6M) long term and bring in Carter… This gives us a true number 1 winger and Quick signed long term. I think Martinez and Drewiske can fill in for greene and Mitchel. Let me know your thoughts
Stuart Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:54 am
@jacky boy, I can’t even imagine what you’re on if you think AMart and DD2 would fill in for greener and Mitchell.
Maybe Dean could ask Jim Buss what he would do, and then do the opposite.
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CB14 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 5:55 pm
@JackKent Cooke, Haha. Very true.
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Poorman Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:10 pm
@JackKent Cooke, I think they are the perfect pair. With the performance of both, it’s obvious to me, they already have been consulting with each other. Let’s see, letting Lamar Odom go, signing Mike Brown as coach instead of Brian Shaw. Genious.
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Kingsfanone Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:15 pm
@Poorman,
Lamar forced that trade when the Commish vetoed the original deal with NO. Odom wasn’t gonna show for camp.
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JackKent Cooke Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:21 pm
@Kingsfanone,
Doubt he was just going to play half-court with the Kardashians; pick-up maybe but not half-court.
CB14 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:23 pm
@Kingsfanone, Neither was Kobe back in 07 when the Lakers wouldn’t trade Bynum and Odom for Kidd. Players get frustrated and say things they don’t always mean. Jim Buss took it as an easy way to make his dad another 14 million dollars this year, Odom’s 9 million doallar salary, and the 4.5 million dollar luxury tax they would have had to pay on it. Jerry Buss never wanted to re-sign Odom anyway, he only did it because he felt he couldn’t get rid of him after they had just won the championship. A bad decision by junior Buss to get rid of LO for nothing IMO.
tornado12 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 1:43 am
@Kingsfanone, I think the lakers r just retooling n opening it up to sign Howard as a FA
King Cobra Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:46 am
@Kingsfanone, Go to the Lakers blog…
I don’t think Bernier should be traded until Quick is signed long term, but I wouldn’t be surprised by it. Dean Lombardi is on the hot seat, and when you’re in a situation like Dean is in sometimes you go for the quick fix as opposed to the right decision for the long term health of the organization. Not saying it will happen, just that it wouldn’t surprise me if it did.
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Kingsfanone Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:11 pm
@CB14,
Totally agree with you.
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Poorman Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:11 pm
@CB14, Hopefully, AEG is tying his hands.
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Niko Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:20 pm
@Poorman,
And not forcing them
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variable Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:18 pm
@CB14,
it all depends on how secure he feels his job is…
i made this point on an early thread and several times in the past…:
upper management said before the season started that they wanted to see “measurable” and “significant” improvement from last season…
to me, that means getting out of the first round…
but who knows what that really means, since no one from AEG has clearly defined what that actually entails in terms of team accomplishment…
so if deano knows what that standard is/means, he will probably play his cards accordingly…
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McSorleyfan Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:54 am
@variable, it could simply mean selling out consistently, which they have done…
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variable Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:39 am
@McSorleyfan,
i never looked at it from a sales p.o.v….but that’s an interesting take…
number 6 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:00 am
@CB14,
Yes CB14. I agree wholeheartedly. I think he is on the hot seat. So, no it wouldn’t surprise me, though I think it would be an idiotic move.
ALMOST one thing….. not one thing, but almost one thing if Bernier is having another season this year like he did last year and is really proving to be a 1a or 1b goaltender. But like two years ago, Quick is being overworked (which may not be a problem…. just don’t know that it’s necessary) and therefore Bernier is not the asset that he would have been otherwise with other teams champing at the bit to get him.
Now you’d get a whole step down if that makes sense from what you would have gotten otherwise.
[Reply]
Why not just go with what we have? The scoring slumps are just aberrations. Maybe some of the players, Stoll, Penner, Richards, Brown and the third line will be more consistent. I know it is a big what if but if we make a trade and give up a couple of players and things don;t work out, then where will the team be?
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fsd1 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 7:45 am
@Bonvivant, exactly!
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Stuart Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:02 am
@Bonvivant, agree. You look around the league and other players are slumping this year too, Zetterberg comes to mind. It just so happens that several of our top6 are in a slump of their lives this year…
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The Kings can’t trade themselves into being a Cup contender this year. So not point is rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. Their best bet is to deal expendable assets to contenders for draft picks or prospects.
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Forum gold Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:16 pm
@JackKent Cooke, This kind of logic does not belong here. GO KINGS GO!!!
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Dominick Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:45 pm
@JackKent Cooke, If we were in Anahiems spot, I could see maybe having that mind set, but we’re firmly in playoff contention, soooooo not gonna happen.
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JackKent Cooke Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:02 pm
@Dominick,
Playoff contention but far from Cup contention.
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fsd1 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 7:45 am
@JackKent Cooke, anyone in the playoffs has the same chance.
variable Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:14 pm
@JackKent Cooke,
yep…
we are who we thought we were…
oh, wait…(!)
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JackKentCooke Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:15 pm
@variable,
Playoffs? Playoffs. We can’t score a goal on St. Louis.
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variable Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:19 pm
@JackKentCooke,
i’m actually leaning towards not doing much of anything – a very unpopular choice amongst the bloggers here…
but it seems like if we can somehow just score a lil’ bit more, we can be a formidable opponent come – cue mora – the playoffs…
JackKentCooke Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:55 pm
@JackKent Cooke,
No need to put lipstick on a pig
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Dominick Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:19 am
@JackKentCooke, You’d rather tank the season now, and build for next years?
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JackKentCooke Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:35 am
@
I think despite Sutter’s remarkable efforts, the lack of speed and skill is so acute that it is beyond the reasonable scope of trade deadline possibilities to expect material help considering what little we can offer and what little is available with so many teams in contention. Is that one sentence?
Dominick Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 2:00 am
@JackKentCooke, LOL! Yes it was.
I think the speed is there, just not in the system consistantly. When you look at the teams the Kings dominated since Sutter got here (not teams we just won against, or managed to win in a shootout, but a clear cut, sound, decisive victory on every level by the Kings) every single 1 of them was where the Kings played a high tempo game. Pheonix (twice), Chicago, Vancouver (twice), Washington, Calgary (the first time we plaed them), Ottowa, Columbus (the last time we played them), and last night against Tampa.
Consistancy is hard because Sutter’s still trying to adjust, but the Kings are a force to be rekoned with if they play an up tempo game. When they don’t, they score 2 or less evvery time.
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I think if anyone needs a good goaltender, he’s gone.
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No way you trade Bernier!! JQ is not under contract yet…if you trade away his competition then you set yourself up to have to deal with a monster contract proposal from JQ…somebody mentioned possibly trading JQ…if that happens, you guys might be happy to know that you will never see me on this blog again because I would have died from a major heart attack…Bernier s worth is not enough to bring an impact player our way…in effect, the Kings would be giving up an insurance policy and a darn good keeper in nets for next to nothing in return…I believe you try to sign Both these guys as soon as possible…if you can get Bernier locked then you have some insurance…
Yes, Bernier is a bargaining chip…for the Kings front office if ya catch my drift
[Reply]
This is the only proposed trade I’ll ever suggest on this blog since proposed trades are a waste of time and written space and energy. But I must propose this. It’s a tough one: Would you trade Dean Lombardi for Jim Buss?
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Kingsfanone Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:20 pm
@Poorman,
I’d trade you for Dr. Drew in a heartbeat.
Lombardi isn’t done yet. Besides, Kupchak is his counterpart, Buss is the owner.
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yetiman_oc Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:35 pm
@Kingsfanone, Ok then AEG for Buss. Kings need an owner with a pulse.
Don’t like seeing the negative comments towards the Poorman. He likes JB and dislikes DL. Not bad takes and he is consistent with his message.
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Adamic39 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:45 pm
@Kingsfanone, +1 how bout poorman for Psyco Mike. It worked for loveline.
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McSorleyfan Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:58 am
@Kingsfanone, OUCH!!! Dirty pool…
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Forum gold Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:20 pm
@Poorman, I would for Jeanie Buss! GO KINGS GO!!!
[Reply]
Kingsfanone Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:32 pm
@Forum gold,
Now your talking! Jeannie Buss.
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variable Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:04 pm
@Poorman,
nah…
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All this crying for a scorer and we are loaded with them!
That’s not what we need. We lost all of our grinders, the guys that won the board battles in the O-zone and didn’t care if their kidneys got ground up in the crease.
Frolov, Smyth, Simmonds – all board grinders.
Smyth, Zus – crease monkeys.
Our top two lines are all 30 goal scorers.
For the existing system, we need grinders. For the future we need playmakers.
Good thing we got Lokti for the future.
Good thing we got Kitsyn for the grinders future.
The rest is just temporal birthing pains.
Trading for a sniper will not solve our problems of O time, puck possession and playmaking.
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CB14 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:37 pm
@Token, Agree on everything.
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Dominick Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:49 pm
@Token, I agree with your final analysis. We only differ on how we come to that conclussion. “temporal birthing pains” Friggin genius! lol
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variable Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:13 pm
@Token,
i like what you have to say…
a lot of truth to the grinder/cycle-theory…
but are scorers have been snake-bitten for whatever reason – poor shot selection…poor creativity…poor eyesight…
pick yr poison…
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Kenny44 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 10:03 pm
@variable, Poor eyesight? Somebody must have introduced the players to the vodka eyeball shot
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number 6 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:04 am
@variable,
Hey – you’re a writer…. ‘our’ scorers instead of ‘are’ scorers.
Anyway…. the lad makes a lot of sense I must say. Shows that it’s not Only a case of skill and hands up front and I have to agree with that. But boils down to chemistry.
[Reply]
variable Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:18 am
@number 6,
ooops…sorry…
i don’t proofread enough…(!)
wavesinair Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:17 am
@variable,
You’re (not your) fired.
[Reply]
variable Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:20 am
@wavesinair,
no…i re-sign…(hehe)…:)
bfstyle33 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 10:25 am
@Token, Bingo!!! Couldn’t agree more. We need 1 or 2 grinders who is not afraid to go in the crease. We have too many of the same players….Richardson, Lewis, Lokti, Kopitar, Richards, Penner, Stoll and Williams are all perimeter players.
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JD Reply:
February 10th, 2012 at 5:05 am
@bfstyle33, Of course, the answer was right there all along, we don’t have enough grinders
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Since last year’s Penner deal looked good on paper, hopefully this year, before making any deal, management will look at the player/s on the ice.
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I think it’s wrong for our writers to bring up the possibility of trading one of our players. Let the bloggers do it….I think this would hurt Bernier mentally if he sees that you started a subject about him leaving the Kings. I really love you and this blog but I think your kind of like family, and it is kind of like talking about trading your own kid for someone better.
[Reply]
CB14 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:35 pm
@tellmeY, I think you have a misconception about just how close Rich is to the Kings and their players. He’s a journalist who just so happens to be employed by the Kings, nothing more. (and I mean that in a good way Rich) There’s no diference in Rich writing about this than Helene Elliott bringing it up.
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tellmeY Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:43 pm
@CB14, just what I feel….it’s all good.
[Reply]
Rich you already brought up the obvious: ‘The nightmare scenario for the Kings would be to trade Bernier, then have Quick walk next summer.’
That’s right. And there are two exceptional ways to initiate that. 1) Have the Kings keep stretching to score at a rather paltry pace and 2) trade Bernier….. probably not get all that much for him for the reasons you mention (i.e. we know how good he is but others don’t) and then Quick’s bargaining starts to resemble that of DD from last year. Btw, not that Quick has anything resembling the same mentality as Mr. Doughty…. but I’m sure his agent would embrace a situation where he can wave Zatkoff as the Kings No. 1 goalie for next season. Not a nice thought is it? Oh, and nothing personal against Zatkoff.
Final point re: Bernier. From my pov, they’ve mismanaged this asset. Not last year, but the year before when tm rode Quick big time and this year w Bernie having massive gaps of time between starts. Hey it isn’t easy to do any skill…. especially a physical one like playing music or a sport when you don’t do it on a regular basis. And they’d trade him based on such a mediocre season?
Hey, thats the great thing about being a Kings fan as basically even though DL is not a bad gm, nothing surprises us anymore.
[Reply]
variable Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:03 pm
@number 6,
if quick wasn’t playing like a vezina winner, i’m sure that bernier would have gotten/would be getting more action…
[Reply]
Duncanz Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:18 am
@number 6, It’s appropriate to use the term “mismanaged” with ‘riding Quick big time’ as an example.
Remember when JB was chosen when JQ was on his shutout streak earlier in the season. Kings lost and everyone here went berserk over the decision.
As @variable alludes, if there’s anything that isn’t fair to JB it’s what a fantastic goalie he’s got to play behind.
[Reply]
Duncanz Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:20 am
@Duncanz, * not appropriate *
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PaulHB Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 4:30 am
@number 6, Don’t underestimate Jeff Zatkoff. He may well be on the same level as Quick & Bernier. And let’s all remember that nobody had ever heard of Jonathon Quick until he got called up. The buzz back then was that the job was Bernier’s for the taking. I’ve seen Zatkoff play and he’s VERY good. He just made the AHL All Star team. He’s no slouch. Plus there’s Martin Jones too.
I wouldn’t be shocked if DL traded Bernier but I don’t think it’ll be at the deadline. The Kings wouldn’t be able to get the scoring help they need in exchange for Bernier right now. But I do see him getting traded at the draft.
There are a few Kings players who I think need to start thinking about how to pack their suitcases in a couple of weeks. Namely guys like Brown, Penner, Brad Richards, Mitchell, & maybe even Scuderi all need to be worried. It’s time to shake things up.
[Reply]
number 6 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:07 am
@PaulHB,
Brad Richards they won’t be able to trade as he’s on another team… but I got your drift.
[Reply]
trytodethroneus Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:37 am
@PaulHB,
I didn’t know today was April 1st
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King Cobra Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:52 am
@number 6, –NEWS FLASH–
Quick and Bernier are not the only 2 good goalies in the NHL.
P.S. Of course I want to re – sign Quick…
Oh and Trade Doughty for Nash…
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F No.
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Dominick Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 6:50 pm
@Kingscup25, concur with the “F” part.
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Why not trade Bernier?
1) As mentioned above, it would be smart to hold onto Bernier until after Quick is locked-up long term.
2) Quick’s a competitive guy. Having another potential #1 goalie around helps foster his consistency.
3) Even after Bernier’s contract expires at the end of NEXT season, he’s still be an RFA, so Lombardi can trade his rights, or do a “sign and trade.”
4) Every goalie gets hurt at some point. It’s been 30 years since the Kings have had this level of depth in goal. As a fan, I’d like to enjoy it for a little longer.
5) Bernier’s value is only going to go up as older goalies -like Brodeur, Kiprusoff, Roloson- get older.
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hip-check Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:04 pm
@InfiN8,
Id trade Bernier to Columbus for their first round pick……
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Duncanz Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:34 am
@InfiN8, Great points!
You don’t know what you’ve got till it’s gone.
Kings are more spoiled right now than many fans realize. There was a long period over the last two decades when Kings goaltending was a complete revolving door – and it was killing us!
There must be a LOT of clubs envious of the duo the Kings have at the back right now.
Kings are STILL about the second youngest team in the league so if the pundits can find some patience we’re going to be really, really good if we can retain what we have invested in.
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Gagne left a hole that needs to be filled bottom line. So I hope DL looks at the teams needs in that regard.
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I say go all in. Bet the farm! afterall “The Time Is Now” whats the worst that could happen? another 5 yr plan?
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All we heard about 2 years ago was how much DL “liked this group” and wasn’t going to trade anyone…but then this year he pulls the trigger on Simmonds/Mr deal trading away a very good prospect as well and let’s Smythe get away also…funny how expectations make you do some things you may regret…the FA that you didn’t get ( Kovalchuk, Brad Richards) makes you trade away young, previously untradable talent for a proven talent who is was supposed to be an impact player…I think MR is a good player, but in order for him to make an impact he has to have better forwards around him…which he hasn’t had really all year…
My fear is that DL might feel he is on the hot seat and do something out of desperation…but, that’s the english way…thought i’d something more to say
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I say he should be a bargaining chip, but only cashed in if there is a great offer on the table. There are a lot of people here saying, “don’t trade him no matter what.” I would definitely be listening to all offers on him and willing to make a move if there was a Mike Richards caliber player available.
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Yeah real smart lets keep JB for another year to sit on the bench and play 10 games then trade him he’ll probably have great value by then
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Duncanz Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:43 am
@meister könig, I feel one of Bruins’ unsung strengrhs is Tuuka Rask.
Without him, would TT really be able to maintain his level under the burden of having to play a lot more games?
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My prediction is that if there are any trades players coming from the kings will be drewiske and a prospect…but not bernier.
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In terms of play, what would the Kings be giving up if they moved DD? I like him, dont get me wrong, but when was out, we didnt miss a step on defense..actually, some players stepped up and played better. So, in practical terms, not emotional, what would we really lose?
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DBking Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:53 pm
@jack, Jack Johnson? Is that you?
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tornado12 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 1:57 am
@DBking, Lol
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King Cobra Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:58 am
@jack,
We would lose –
A) 7 million dollars in salary
B) Game losing turnovers
C) Game losing missed hip checks
D) Our over rated under performing Highest paid player
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@KingsFanFTW, What makes anybody think quick will resign here. There are going to be plenty of GM’s looking at him, if he goes to a real hockey town, he’ll get the league wide recognition he deserves, and get to play alot closer to home. If I’m Boston’s gm, I look to sign quick to replace Thomas, trade task for a first, and some prospects, then your teams set for many more runs at the cup. Or just imagine how big quick would be in Toronto, I mean everybody knows how much Burke likes Americans. If we trade bernier in some stupid trade for the short term, next year at this time were going to end up with a zaktoff, who has never even played a minute in the league, and some journeyman like Sanford. Lombardi gets fired, we start a new 5 year rebuild, except we’re paralyzed by beign up against the cap. We need to think about just riding out the season with this roster, this is a deeply flaws roster. And trading from a weak position for some overpriced vet with a terrible contract (carter) is just going to set us back farther
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KingsFanFTW Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:22 pm
@JD, i didnt say he would sign with the Kings..I just i wouldnt plan on trading Bernier if Quick not lock up long term…
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KingsFanFTW Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:23 pm
@KingsFanFTW, damnit delete the I
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g smith86 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:44 pm
@JD, yea…tend to agree with you as far as not trading
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bernier will not get traded during this season…
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Crownme87 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:24 pm
@variable,
I hope you’re right.
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variable Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:01 pm
@Crownme87,
i think most of us have been saying this all along for the same reasons/questions that RICH indicated above…
there would also have to be a parallel move to accommodate any sort of trade involving him, since neither zatkoff or jones would be called into nhl action…
dl is not a gambler when it comes to his netminders…and i really can’t see him becoming one at this point…
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Duncanz Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:53 am
@variable, … although he didn’t seem to completely take the idea off the table in that quote, eh?
Maybe the language employed was designed to assuage the masses driven by the lust for major acquisitions …
Gustavo Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 8:41 pm
@variable,
I hope you’re right, but if he can be packaged to dump salary I’d go for it. The only player I’d be like to see spend the rest of his career in LA is Jerome Iginla. To cover his salary I’d send Bernier, Penner and Stoll.
1.20 million +
4.25 million +
3.50 million = 8.95 million
Iggy’s contract = 7.0 million
Send Gagne to LIR and you got about 6 million in cap space to end the season with, not to mention a vastly reinforced offense.
1 iginla = 3 Penners + 5 Stolls
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number 6 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:09 am
@Gustavo,
and who pre tell would want Stoll and Penner?…. in a trade or not in a trade.
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Stand pat. D wins out
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Kenny44 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 10:17 pm
@Jayrew, Not by itself, not anymore, not in the playoffs anyway. Look at who was in the finals for the last five years. none of those teams play d at all costs. What they seem to have in common are a couple big time defensemen with a serviceable group behind that, lots of depth at forward, and the ability to score goals.
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jayrew Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 7:04 am
@Kenny44, bruins. worst power play in the league, including playoffs. we’ll score in the playoffs. dont panic kings fan
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USHA#17 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:09 am
@jayrew,
have to get there first.
The only way I trade Bernier for anything is if Nash comes back and Columbus takes Penner and Stoll. In other words, I wouldn’t trade Bernier.
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USHA#17 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:13 am
@colo king fan,
The -71 lifetime Rick Nash or the 2011-12 version of the -21 Rick Nash???
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What about Bernier to Columbus for their first round pick……would be most tempting to get first overall.
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again, i’m not vocalizing for this to happen, so hold yr fire…
but…
jj is the most realistic large trading piece we have…IF…we are looking to acquire a big offensive piece in return…
i honestly think that dl won’t trade him unless he gets an offer from vito corleone…and i’m really on the side that dl is probably gonna get b and c-level help, if he;s able to accomplish anything at all…
too many teams still in it…and too much wanted in return for what’s available…and probably too expensive for us…eh, um…too…
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g smith86 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:12 pm
@variable, yep…agree…and have been saying it all along…the kings are not in a position to deal
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Kenny44 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 10:21 pm
@variable, Oh great, another Trentmarco Sturmhunter or Jeffethan Moreauhalpern – just what we need
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variable Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 10:32 pm
@Kenny44,
i know…i know…
but…
it’s typical of dl, no…(?)
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Kenny44 Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:09 pm
@variable, Yes, it is. And last year’s deadline fiasco will only reinforce that.
We needs to stand firm, I cannot see trading anyone right now, our chemistry is starting to show signs of gelling.
We are not going to get a top 6 guy in the current market, nor can we do anything with our netminders until we lock one down, and we cannot even do that til next year.
We are short on cap space, we wont see anything done until the offseason.
Kick back and keep yelling Go Kings Go! That is the smart move.
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This team is a mess and it’s DL s fault…not that there aren’t some good players on this team, but the Kings are so back heavy and loaded at center…that leaves no one to put the puck in the net…ie, the forwards…who are either underachieving or simply just don’t have the talent…the team is definitely playing more inspired under Sutter, but still can’t score…we all know we have needs at forward…so then why has the GM decided that center was the most crucial area to fill…and why is it that some of you feel that this team is starting to gel…They play hard, no question..but they haven’t shown any signs of consistant scoring all season long…when you say “starting to gel” I assume you mean gelling on the offensive end…with so many guys playing out of their comfort zones and switching from center to wing, left to right, etc… it’s a wonder we score at all…that’s why I say the team’s a mess and it’s all DL s fault…
It’s now up to the players to some how find a way to score consistantly..there will be no help in the form a of a big trade…and besides, DL would probably give up a winger for another center
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I was looking over Berniers numbers, and thinking of what money he will be trying to aquire in his upcoming negotiations. I came up with $1.8 mill for 3 years. Basically the same deal that Quick made when he was stepping in to be considered #1. Quick has far exceeded that value, and proved to be a #1, but at this point, Bernier has still got to prove if he is handed the reins, he can succeed.
I think he can, but the value has already been set when Quick made his deal in the spot that Bernier’s in now. That would not only make him a steal if he works out (much like Quicks deal is), but if he’s traded in the future, teams would look at that price tag as a bargain.
On a side note, I found it very surprising that Quicks contract actually payed the most the 1rst year, and then went down in actual payout cost each year after, so that we’re left paying the least amount for his services next season, while negotiating his next contract, for a raise.
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tornado12 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 2:05 am
@Dominick, People need to remember that we don’t have to trade bernier as he is a restricted FA when his contract is up. The kings are in the best position goalie wise they have ever been in, why screw that up?
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Kings need Rick Nash, make cap space for him. Drop penner, IR cagne. Trade bernier, JW, stoll and drewskie. With Nash on the team they become a feared and lethal offense to compliment the great defense. A good run at the cup and quick won’t leave and he is not greedy. Pick up a grinder like simmonds and the kings are all set, yes?
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Dominick Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 9:53 pm
@Name optional, Nash is a good player (better than his +/- suggests). BUT! he hasn’t saved Columbus, or made them a better team. How is trading 1/2 the team to get him gonna transform us?
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DBking Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:56 pm
@Name optional, I would rather have Jeff Carter with a 5.25m cap hit then Rick Nash with a 7.8m cap hit.
A 7.8 million dollar cap hit on one player when we already have 2 guys making virtually 7m per would significantly hinder our flexibility when it comes to filling certain roles that are necessary when you talk about winning a cup. Boston doesn’t win the cup last year without Shawn Thornton bringing that ultimate grit that knocked the Canucks off their game while being down 2-0 in the series. His cap hit is .8 mill.
I have said this before but I really would love to see Jeff Carter on the wing beside Richards. If we can’t get him I’d rather wait and see if we can woo Parise with the free cap space.
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Dominick Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 1:08 am
@DBking,
Kopi will garner that much on his next contract. I’d say minimum 7.6 mill (could be over if he has a career year in scoring next season), and that’s light at 700K over what he’s making now. Hopefully in a couple of years that will be easier to manage than what it sounds like today, but in a couple of years the Kings will have 2, 7 million dollar players without adding to it by picking up another one on the way (like a Nash, or Parise).
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Gustavo Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:16 am
@Dominick,
If you’re going to project salaries to several years down the road, a significant consideration should be given to future salary cap expansion. It plays a huge role.
deadcatbounce Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 8:30 am
@DBking, On the wing and at the bar next to Richards…
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You only trade Bernier in the right deal. If Bernier nets you a proven goal scorer you make the move. It’s more likely DL can re-sign Quick than sign a goal scorer like Parise.
I really like Bernier and would love for the Kings to keep him, but the Kings have holes and having Bernier play 10-15 games a year is a waste.
The rumored deal out there is Bernier/Stoll for Carter/Sanford. I take that deal in a minute. The Kings get a quality backup for this year, they have multiple quality prospects coming in the next year or two and there are plenty of goaltenders out there each summer for a backup next year if one is needed. Stoll is playing out of position and his contract is expiring.
DL won’t trade Bernier unless the deal results in a quality top-6 NHLer. if he can’t get that i think he will look to move him in the summer.
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CabbagesAndKings Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 10:32 pm
@Dave, I think we would have to sweeten the deal a bit more to land Carter and Sandford — but I completely agree that if we do end up trading Bernier, I’d sure like to get a decent backup coming back in the trade.
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number 6 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:11 am
@Dave,
Sorry Dave… minutes up.
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A lot of great points on why we should or should not trade Bernier in this thread. But broadly stating that we should or should not trade any player just doesn’t make any sense. The only reasonable discussion would evolve around, “would you trade this player for this amount?”
It’s safe to say that you should trade any player if you can get back a greater value in return. Everyone should take a moment and let their great points on why we should or should trade Bernier evolve into, “what is Bernier worth to this organization?” and “what amount of value would we need in a trade to move him?”
The points that say, “we shouldn’t trade bernier because (insert reason)” should be reformed into saying, “because of (insert reason), Bernier is this valuable to us, and we would need this amount in a trade to come out winners.”
Bernier to Columbus for their next three first round picks? Yes.
Bernier to Columbus for a third round pick? No.
But where is the middle ground that represents his true value? That’s the question.
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variable Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 10:51 pm
@CabbagesAndKings,
value is all predicated on what another teams needs are and what they are willing to pay for them…or what the sellers needs are and how much they are willing to sell off in order to obtain them…
if the market on a 23 year-old goalie, who is thought to be a future number one, but with only 42 games of experience, only gets you that second or third-round pick, then you probably are against trading him because you are most likely not gonna get equal/greater value in return…
so you right when you say,”‘what is Bernier worth to this organization?’ and ‘what amount of value would we need in a trade to move him?’” …
but honestly, that’s what every gm should be asking with any move that they consider…
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Osaka Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:13 pm
@variable, He would be worth more than one first round pick, a prospect is worth more than a draft pick (unless we are talking about a top 3 overall pick). He was chosen 11th overall with the idea he would be a number one goalie. The Kings have developed him for years and he has lived up to the expectations. Of course we would not be looking at picks but NHL talent. I just don’t see the value in the NHL for goalies being that high these days. A few years ago a top goalie prospect would have brought more. Ever since Chicago won the cup and let their goalie go, the market for goalies took a big dip.
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CabbagesAndKings Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:23 pm
@Osaka, I also have trouble figuring out what goalies are worth these days, which goes double for goalie prospects.
Varlamov secured a 1st and a 2nd rounder from Colorado (pretty high picks) for Washington. Although Varlamov had more NHL experience, that’s only trade I can think of to use as a bench mark.
Can anyone else think of some young goalies that have been traded over the last few years?
variable Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:28 pm
@Osaka,
well, as far as bernier “living up to expectations” thus far…hmmm…i’m not so sure…i think he’s shown glimpses of brilliance, but hasn’t really be able to sustain much of anything this year…last year, he was what cory schneider is to the canucks this year…so, that’s why this is such a heated debate…plus the fact that he has been tabbed a number one prospect for years now by many professional scouting agencies…
i do think he’s gonna be a good one, but he has to eventually play – somewhere – to fully quantify what he’s true worth really is…
i still think he stays a king, at least until next year’s training camp…
Osaka Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:49 pm
@Variable,
He dominated in the AHL and he is backing up Quick in the NHL. Quick is third in the league in save percentage and third in goals against average. Did you expect Bernier to take the #1 job? Everyone knows he hasn’t played enough to do anything. Statistically the only goalies in the NHL that have outplayed Quick are Lundqvist and Elliot, that means everyone else would be on the bench with Bernier. I am not a big Bernier fan or anything, I just don’t think he has hurt his value at all. His value now is as high as it has ever been (for a prospect).
rontheking Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:07 pm
@CabbagesAndKings,
You can’t get his true value–because his true value is unknown at this point. What if you trade him and then Quick goes down with an injury before or during the playoffs? It’s absurd to even consider trading him at this point for that reason alone.
The other point to consider is that the kings are very much in the thick of the playoff hunt while being last in the league in scoring. Yet we know by past numbers that these same players typically do score much more than they have as of yet…
So an optimist would see the cup as half full and expect–with some sense of reasonable rationale–that scoring will come around at some point…and find some comfort in the fact that this team has done as well as it has and almost certainly hasn’t peaked yet performance wise in terms of offense–and might very well peak late in the year and possibly even during the playoffs, which is the optimist’s best scenario of all….
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Osaka Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:24 pm
@rontheking, His value is determined by what top goalie prospects have demanded in the past deals around the NHL. The market has pretty much been set on what the value of every type player is. What his future value might be is insignificant. He may develop into an all-star or he may be a bust, that has no bearing on his trade value.
Whether or not he should be traded is another issue but Dean already knows what he could get for Bernier, that is his true value, the market value.
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CabbagesAndKings Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:29 pm
@Osaka, I don’t know what true value means. But there is definitely a distinction between a players market value and the value a player has to a team.
If market value is greater then team value — you trade him.
If market value is less then team value — you keep him.
I saw it on a bumpersticker.
Osaka Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:58 pm
@CabbagesAndKings,
Like you said Varlamov got the Caps a 1st and a 2nd, that is where the market has been set. Is Bernier worth more than that to the Kings? Of course the Kings would want a player instead of the draft picks. What forward is worth a 1st and 2nd? Viktor Stalberg of Chicago?
The Kings don’t need a superstar IMO to put them over the hump, but do need 2 quality wingers. The Kings currently have 4 top nine forwards. I would love to see the Kings pick up two wingers and move Stoll (maybe also Penner) to the 3rd line.
If you want to quote Brian Burke, I heard him say this year: “You can’t be a GM if your afraid to make a mistake. You will make a bad trade, everybody does. You can’t let mistakes affect your judgement. If you have a chance to make your team better, you damn well better.”
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CabbagesAndKings Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:15 pm
@Osaka, I completely agree that two top 6 forwards are what the Kings need to be a cup contender. Which although doubtful right now — hopefully happens before next season. I don’t see to many potential trade partners (unless it was two seperate trades) that could yield two wingers.
I like MacAthur and Kulimen from the Leafs. Or maybe Wheeler and Whitney in seperate deals?
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Osaka Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:26 pm
@CabbagesAndKings, If Phoenix would trade Whitney to us…. I was thinking the same thing.
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tornado12 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 2:13 am
@Osaka, Boom….we have a winner
Trade JJ to Philadelphia for Van Riemsdyk and you have a good start. And then find a better player or two for your bottom six.
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DBking Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:54 pm
@Alex,
I would rather have Jeff Carter with a 5.25m cap hit then Rick Nash with a 7.8m cap hit.
A 7.8 million dollar cap hit on one player when we already have 2 guys making virtually 7m per would significantly hinder our flexibility when it comes to filling certain roles that are necessary when you talk about winning a cup. Boston doesn’t win the cup last year without Shawn Thornton bringing that ultimate grit that knocked the Canucks off their game while being down 2-0 in the series. His cap hit is .8 mill.
I have said this before but I really would love to see Jeff Carter on the wing beside Richards. If we can’t get him I’d rather wait and see if we can woo Parise with the free cap space.
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5holer Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 12:03 am
@DBking, The best post of the day…actually makes some good sense in my book! Get your Tarot Cards out and take a look….let me know what you see, won’t you? Tough sledding through trade deadline mentalities league wide! My dog is worth more then your dog any day! And so on and so on! Throw the dice and see what happens cause it ain’t happening here with this group…Miracles? Not likely. Or is it another throw away season? Yikes! Time will tell I guess!
2 points in Sunrise Florida or Bust! See ya!
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DBking Reply:
February 8th, 2012 at 11:55 pm
@Alex, Replied to the wrong post!
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This is an enigma of a team roster here! Doctor somebody and Mister somebody else? You never know from shift to shift, play stoppage to play stoppage, or period to period what you are going to get offensively. Just seems they are short on talent, confidence and lack trust in each other up front. Definite change is required to remedy this starved group. All stats to measure any individual’s production is ambiguous and totally skewed this season. Not one guy is having a quality year offensively, most having their poorest production. Its epidemic. Defying the odds for 28 more games is not reasonable to expect. Taking chances is how to win offensively, but being smart governs those chances being taken or not taken. Its either good or bad judgement, but that’s only determinable in retrospect. Same for management decisions, so it is time to take some chances because the alternative is not palletible, nor reasonable to rely upon(a Darryl Evans conjunction!). Another lost year spells Disaster to the development of this Franchise on a successful path. This regime has missed on several fronts, but not for the lack of trying to do something plausible. Its a bottom line business regardless of good intentions. Jury hung so far, but may be coming in with a verdict soon enough! Curtains or Curtain call? I wonder what that polished up ouigi board says?
Sayonara Kids!
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number 6 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:12 am
@5holer,
Thats a really good post.
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Sign Quick now & trade Bernier to Columbus for the 1st round pick…
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Sign Bernier now and trade Quick and a 1st round pick for Stamkos.
JB can be a #1 (I hope) and TB needs a goalie sooooo bad…..
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Are some of you guys serious with what you psot? Trade JJ/Doughty/etc..
This team’s strength lies with its goaltending and defense. Whya re we going to weaken ourselves?
I also don’t see the Kings moving bernier before the off season. There’s not enough out there to warrant taking the gamble of losing a guy you might have to count on if something happened to Quick.
I’m sure there are smaller deals to be had once you get to the deadline, but I’ve said it before. The major deals at the deadline rarely work. It’s always buyers remorse..see Penner!
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number 6 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:13 am
@nykingfan,
…………………………… correct…………………………….
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Something got put ineveryones water last night, i can tell. What a bunch of loopiness going on here.
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Nash just needs to go Toronto for Schenn and Top prospect with a pick. Carter needs come to the Kings for Bernier, and Johnson. Or switch it around Nash to Kings and Carter to Toronto, but I dont see Kings wanting 7.8 cap hit. But THINK of Columbus. Johnson, Schenn, Bernier, with number one pick coming their way is perfect. They will be better already.
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I think the DD trade would be great! I told my wife they better not sign him during the hold out. Him and pancakes would bring in some good solid wingers that have no lead in their asses.
These guys are slouching back down into Terry Murrey mode. It’s a joke…..
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Let’s just assume, since some people on here seem to think that’s the answer, that the Kings trade Bernier to NJ for a signed Parise. Parise will probably sign for seven mill, added to Kopitar’s seven mill and Doughty’s seven mill, and the seven mill that everyone seems to think that JQ will get is $28 mill. Why not add Richards’ five mill and Johnson’s four mill and that’s $37 mill we’re talking about. If there’s still a cap in the next CBA, would you really want a quarter of your team eating up probably more than half your cap space? This doesn’t seem like very responsible money-management to me.
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number 6 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:16 am
@deadcatbounce,
No need. A) Parise is NOT being dealt during the season. Pretty much a guarantee. B) If and when Parise moves…. and it’s still an ‘if’ as I know Lou wants to try and keep him in NJ, there are like three teams minimum that he’s likely to go to before the Kings. So, ………. so … thats all folks.
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First of all…anyone thinking of trading DD, a 22 year old defensman who is probably 7 or 8 years away from hitting his prime, are just insane!
Do you really think Lidstrom was anywhere near the player his is today when he was only 22? Defenseman like Lidstrom come around once every 20 years or so. DD will never be a Nick Lidstrom, but players like DD don’t fall off trees either. Imagine how good this kid will be once this team starts scoring goals like an average NHL team.
Quick isn’t going anywhere. He will get locked up this off season to a reasonable contract. The guy is all class and very humble. Bernier only gets moved for the right player and not a rental.
I’m not a huge Carter fan, but his cap hit is very reasonable and he has history playing with Richards. I think when you weigh those two facts vs an unknown, this is the guy you go after. Bernier + Martinez + draft pick + minor league player should get it done.
Parise is not going anywhere. NJ is playing well and if anyone has watched the devils play, he makes that team go. NJ will resign him.
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King Cobra Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:42 am
@Barry’s Mullet, You made my point for me – “7 or 8 years away from hitting his prime” that is exactly when his contract is up!! You forgot to add the word “maybe” before hitting his prime.
So we pay Webber Lindstrom money for him now in the hopes he becomes like them, that is insane.
He is greedy and selfish, just what JJ is not.
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Barry's Mullet Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 11:31 am
@King Cobra, I think you need a little perspective.
1. DD is already considered around the league as a very good and still very YOUNG dman. He is also considered one of a few dman projected to be an elite player when he does hit his prime. The point to locking him up for so long is that you will have him when he does hit his prime. What it cost you after that is really irrelevant because we have no idea what the market will look like in 2020.
2. If every dman is going to be based on one player, that being Lidstrom who no one currently playing will ever be as good as, no dman the Kings have or will ever deserve to get paid elite money by your standards.
3. Everyone wanted to lock DD up for a long time. $7m year is what it took to accomplish this.
4. How much do you think an elite dman is going to make per season in 2020. How much would a Lidstrom get in 8 years. Its safe to say its going to be a crap load more than anyone is making today. $10m / $15m per season. Its all relative
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number 6 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 1:23 pm
@Barry’s Mullet,
Barry, my opinion. You did a perfect post w the one exception of the stuff about Carter.
Other than that you’re spot on.
My reasons: What if Carter goes downhill in three years? Then what? What do you do with the last SEVEN years of his contract that is a NTC?
There is just to much question mark around that guy. I’d say wait and see what Toffoli can do next year or the year after rather than make an impetuous move because they can’t score goals. Then it all becomes about Carter becoming the teams savior.
I can promise you one thing: for sure, just like what you say about Parise being imperative to the Devils is correct, it’s equally correct to say that Carter is not the missing link between the Kings and a Stanley Cup.
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Barry's Mullet Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 4:24 pm
@number 6, I agree with one exception. The Kings are never going to find that one missing link. I think with the current roster and how this team is built, its going to be the sum of the parts and not any one player. We can always dream, but that player is not coming to LA.
I think a player like Toffoli or whomever we have in Manchester who can find the ocean with a beach ball will be a great improvement over anyone with the exception of Clifford in our 6 – 12 spots at forward.
As for Carter, I think you take a big risk when you lock anyone up for that long, but that’s the way teams are going now. Take the risk in exchange for a friendly cap hit. If he can bury 25+ per season and he’s certainly capable of more, but that won’t happen on a team like the Kings that is built for defense. Your best players will struggle playing for the Kings. Which makes it that much harder for mid level or rookies to break through. That’s why the Purcell’s, Molson’s and others excel on teams that are all offense and dead last in defense. Boyle is the only exception and that’s because we gave up on him way too early and the NYR are a very good team!
By the way…with the exception of NYR, those teams are going nowhere come playoffs. My bet is no one wants to play the Kings in the playoffs with our defense and Quick in net.
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“7 or 8 years away from hitting his prime” that is exactly when his contract is up!!
So we pay Webber Lindstrom money for him now in the hopes he becomes like them, that is insane.
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bfstyle33 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 9:48 am
@King Cobra, It won’t be that long…..next year or two you will see a much better DD.
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tornado12 Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 10:25 am
@King Cobra, who did the winnipeg fans boo when we were there? they know a bit about hockey
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Bernier for Jeff Carter straight up
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Everyone who was baying for the Kings to get a goal scorer last year: we got a goal scorer last year and gave up a player who we drafted with a first round pick, a future first round pick and a future third round pick.
Guess What!! Didn’t work out that great did it.
It’s too damned easy to say this stuff on this blog. OK. So he pulls the trigger. Then what will everyone complain about when Bernier becomes a top three goalie in the league (especially if we lose Quick) and Carter ends up being pushed to score 21 goals here while playing average defense.
Come On People!!
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DBking Reply:
February 9th, 2012 at 4:02 pm
@number 6, GettIng Mike Richards for Simmonds and Schenn was a great move. You will notice it in the playoffs when the Kings are in a decicive game. See gold metal game 2010 olympics where MR scored 2 goals. If Bernier is shipped out its not like we have to play with an empty net on the nights Quick doesnt play. We have solid goaltending in our system that can take his place on the bench.
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