When the subject of a Rob Scuderi contract extension was raised on yesterday’s conference call with Dean Lombardi, it brought up the question “But what to do about all of the team’s restricted and unrestricted free agents?”
As it stands now – and a primary assist to CapGeek on this – the Kings have 49.26 million dollars allotted towards 13 players for the 2013-14 season. Because the salary cap drops to 64.3 million dollars next season – and there’s certainly a chance that will happen – unless players currently under contract for next season are traded, Lombardi will be tasked with spending 15.04 million dollars on the following players:
Restricted Free Agents
Kyle Clifford
Trevor Lewis
Jordan Nolan
Slava Voynov
Alec Martinez
Keaton Ellerby
Jake Muzzin
Jonathan Bernier
Unrestricted Free Agents
Rob Scuderi
Dustin Penner
Brad Richardson
Davis Drewiske
Not counting players in the American Hockey League, there are four defensemen currently under contract for 2013-14. Two are currently rehabilitating long-term injuries (Matt Greene, Willie Mitchell) and one has never played in a National Hockey League game (Andrew Campbell).
Because of the scarcity of available top-four defensemen via trade, and the immense cost of obtaining one via free agency, re-signing Slava Voynov will be the team’s largest weight-bearing contract pillar between now and next season. It must be viewed as the team’s highest priority of all unsigned UFAs and RFAs. I’m assuming that Voynov receives a new contract that contains an annual cap hit of between three and five million dollars, which means the team is looking at roughly 10 to 12 million dollars to allot to the names above.
Scuderi isn’t likely to accept a pay cut with Los Angeles, considering he likely would earn more on the open market, and his “ugly but effective game” has been a part of two Stanley Cup blueprints and still translates into defensive success at this level. It’s fair to say that his current 3.4 million dollar cap hit is in the general ballpark of what any hypothetical extension would cost against the team’s cap space.
If Scuderi is to be re-signed, and if Voynov receives the amount of money highlighted above, that leaves roughly 6.5 to 8.5 million dollars of an annual cap hit to allot to the other 10 free agents. Kyle Clifford and Alec Martinez are obviously both heavily involved in the team’s current and future plans, and their new contracts should also be considered priorities, though not necessarily to the same degree as Voynov’s.
There are spaces to fill, prospects such as Tyler Toffoli, Linden Vey and Tanner Pearson worthy of consideration, and a limited amount of capital to make it all work.
So who gets extended? What should the team’s priorities be? What contract figures would seem reasonable to you? On which players is the jury still convening over? Who is likely to be in their last year in Los Angeles?
This is awesome, thanks Jon.
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I don’t want to lose him, but i can see Williams getting the short end of the stick here and being traded.
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40yearkingsfan Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 1:56 pm
@meman,
I totally agree. The money saved from his cap hit would make the difference, and I believe Vey and/or Toffoli will and should get there chance.
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Ed Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:08 pm
@meman, You guys are crazy! Williams is a HUGE part of this team and I say no way he gets traded. I still maintain he is a top 15-20 player in the LEAGUE, with a massive hockey IQ. I do admit I have a bit of man crush on him
, but I really believe he is an integral part of this team.
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jet Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:29 pm
@Ed, I love little willie, but prices have to come down. an important consideration in all of this is how many good players will be available this off season. the normal group of UFA’s, plus 20 or so buyout players, plus RFA’s that their clubs can no longer afford. This will be a good year to be cash rich. I have no doubt ther are a number of players who would play under thier value for a year to visit the engraver. Think Perry or Richards. this off season will be DLs biggest challange to date.
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CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:46 pm
@Ed, You think Williams is a top 20 player in the league and you’re calling other people crazy? That’s crazy.
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Ed Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:56 pm
@CB14 and jet, I see (and agree) with your points to some extent. I guess can’t fall too much in love with players since they always come and go. But we seem to have a VERY tight group right now that has come together and plays very well. I can’t see them messing with that chemistry, unless things start to go south very quickly. How about top 40 player in NHL for J-Dub??
Kings of Hockeywood Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:24 pm
@Ed, I am going to right now off the top of my head name 50 players in the NHL better than Justin Williams, and I’m not even going to include d-men or goalies. PS, Ed, he will either be traded immediately after the season or be one of the Kings’ amnesty buyouts. There is absolutely no other option. No matter how good a teammate he is, he doesn’t produce enough to justify his cap hit when there are guys like Toffoli waiting in the wings. And here we go:
1 A. Kopitar, 2 J. Carter, 3 M. Richards, 4 D. Brown, 5 E. Malkin, 6 S. Crosby, 7 S. Stamkos, 8 J. Jagr, 9 J. Tavares, 10 A. Ovechkin, 11 E. Kane, 12 C. Perry, 13 J. Thornton, 14 P. Marleau, 15 H. Sedin, 16 D. Sedin, 17 J. Iginla, 18 M. Duchene, 19 P. Datsyuk, 20 H. Zetterberg, 21 B. Richards, 22 M. Gaborik, 23 R. Nash, 24 I. Kovalchuk, 25 N. Backstrom, 26 M. Molson, 27 M. St. Louis, 28 P. Kane, 29 J. Toews, 30 P. Sharpe, 31 T. Selanne, 32 R. Getzlaf, 33 D. Briere, 34 C. Giroux, 35 V. Lecavalier, 36 D. Backes, 37 A. Semin, 38 E. Staal, 39 J. Staal, 40 L. Couture, 41. A. Henrique, 42 T. Seguin, 43 P. Kesel, 44 W. Simmonds, 45 J. Benn, 46 T. Vanek, 47 J. Franzen, 48 G. Landeskog, 49 Z. Parise, 50. D. Alfredsson
Seriously, that was 50 off the top of my head and I don’t think there is an argument that Williams is even in the same league as any of those guys. And I didn’t even mention a player from every team in the league. I don’t have a Blue Jacket on there and while they may be a bad team, Dubinsky is a better player than Williams. I didn’t even include young players like Hall, Nugent-Hopkins, Eberle, and Yakupov from Edmonton, all of whom are better than Williams!
Justin Williams is not a bad hockey player by any means, but he also is not a superstar. He has done a good job for the Kings but he is easily replaceable.
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Ed Reply:
February 28th, 2013 at 5:04 pm
@Kings of Hockeywood, Alright man. Why are you getting upset?
I guess Kings have gotten a lot out of him already and at some point he will be let go. I’ll prepare myself for that day! 
ducksuck Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:39 pm
@meman, I don’t see Williams being traded. The guys being traded would be JB or another talented player that has a short term contract. Like the Richards trade kings gave up simmer and schenn and I think a draft pick. The fans who say Williams would be traded don’t play or really understand the amount of talent he has. He is one of the best assist guys in the league! He makes it look simple and is a huge reason for Kopi and others finding the back of the net. He is a bargin at his price and FITS IN! Look at gange he just never clicked. He had/has the talent, but I never saw him on the PK or winning board battles like Kopi and Williams do.
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Token Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 6:18 pm
@meman, on a team so rich with right wingers, count them, 1.
You think they trade him?
Priceless!
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Quisp Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 8:53 pm
At least one of Williams, Stoll, Greene or Mitchell will have to go. Assume Toffoli makes the team. Lewis, Carter and Nolan are all playing the right side. Brown played on the right side most of his career.
But Voynov isn’t getting close to $5MM on an RFA contract. He doesn’t have arbitration rights. (at least, I don’t think he does)
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Token Reply:
February 28th, 2013 at 4:46 pm
@Quisp, Stoll looks like the looser there.
Also would be sleeping a bit on edge if I was Richards. He isn’t producing nearly enough for 5+ mill for the next forever years.
Carter needs speedsters and plays center just fine.
luc20rules Reply:
February 28th, 2013 at 9:14 pm
@meman, Don’t understand the lack of respect for Justin William? In 2 post season runs to win the Stanley Cup with Carl 05-06 25 games 7 G 11 A 18pts +12, with LA 20 games 4 G 11 A 15pts +8. This guy steps up in the playoffs. In the regular season the last 2 years he has averaged 22 G 36A 58pts +8.5 pretty good for 3.65 mil/yr. Also consider the many, many players brought in to bloster the offense and how rarely it works Penner, Stoll, Hunter, Ethan “Power Play” Moreau, Gagne, Richards, etc. Williams, & Carter are really the only ones that have produced as expected on offense.
As much as I value Stoll’s D, Faceoffs, etc. Next year with all FA salaries dropping probably about 30% Stoll & Penner do not make pay rate. Also the Kings have had far more success bringing in productive defensive/non-scoring type players with success. An Eric Belanger type maybe signed for about 1 mil/yr. I think one of the Kings weak spots is the SOs Quick hasn’t been as good at them since 2011-12 and the shooters avgs all sank last year plus the loss of Handzus & JJ have hurt us there.
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Penner, Drewisky, Richardson, leave.
Bernier will be traded, hopefully for high draft picks.
That leaves 5 from your list, all being RFAs, after spending what you say on Voynov, Scuderi.
Doable, I think
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jess Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 1:58 pm
@40yearkingsfan,
Ummmmmm…..
No.
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Brad Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:17 pm
@jess, Bernier for Bouwmeester… it’s gonna happen.
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xeropoint Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:38 pm
@Brad, How in the world could they fit in 6.8M for the next two seasons? Not to mention wether or not (definitely not) he’s even worth that much.
Duncanz Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:46 pm
@Brad, No smiley face on that one?
Brad Reply:
February 28th, 2013 at 12:45 am
It’s actually 6.68 million for the next 2 years. Scurderi and Penner won’t be back if they bring in Bouwmeester, plus I can see the Kings dumping either Mitchell or Williams this off season. Just remember you heard it here first… Bouwmeester for Bernier.
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King John Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:29 pm
@40yearkingsfan, No, Richardson is our fill-in all-around utility player. We need that type of player as the 13th forward.
I still think Dustin Penner can make it here too.
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Osaka Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:35 pm
@King John, Penner can make it here, but he won’t be a $3 mil healthy scratch. I don’t see him being resigned. Not unless he take a big pay cut. He isn’t worth his price.
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This team has been fiscally responsible to a fault since AEG has taken over. They imposed their own “salary cap” before the league adopted one. The Kings were the model franchise for getting players under workable deals that never put individuals over the team. Now that the organization has worked hard to make this team what it is and having to endure the long suffering years of losing and ineptitude we have to make tough decisions because the rest of the league couldn’t make them when they should have.
I don’t know what the answer is but it’s quite apparent that this cap number is crap as it pertains to this team and their will to do things right from the beginning.
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HockeyNerd Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:14 pm
@KOHO, +1
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Shiny Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:27 pm
@KOHO, yes the salary cap era is crap and hinders teams from keeping a lot of good players in the back for “depth” but it sort of “spreads the wealth” if you will so large markets like NY, NJ and LA don’t hog the best players in the league. Blame the expansion if you want because smaller markets like Columbus have enough trouble supporting a hockey team as it is.
What’s truly crap IMO is having a floor and being heavily penalized for not overpaying players or being unwilling to pay them enough to reach this “floor”
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stagger Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:36 pm
@KOHO,
Great post. The Kings have done things the right way as an organization now since DL took over. Building through the draft, starting with the back end. Stockpiling picks for the first few years. Making trades and free-agent signings that fill holes and not just give us quick fixes. Develop a D first system that has built a solid foundation throughout the whole system that the Kings have never had. And finally, they’ve structured it all financially to work over the long haul. Or so we thought.
Now because of some bad decisions by poor business people, the best organizations are being punished because the worst ones have to have self control imposed upon them (IE salary cap, contract limits, etc) to be financially stable.
The Kings were able to structure their business model in a way that the team on the ice is successful, and they fit within the system imposed upon them by owners with no self control. Now they are being asked to tighten the reigns even more because Minnesota or New Jersey or Philly or Nashville or etc. can’t control themselves.
It seems that the smart way to do things would be to model your franchise after another successful one, instead of just throwing money at a team and hoping for the best. Like how DL is always talking about Detroit or the Yankees. But I guess most billionaires have too much ego for that to copy someone else.
GKG!
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Harry_Beev Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 5:50 pm
Being on a Stanley Cup team over inflates every players value. Some of these guys will be hard pressed to find the high salaries on the open market many of you are predicting they’ll receive and could very likely be back under workable contracts.
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That’s the 64 million dollar question isn’t it? Who will be gone?
It seems certain this team will look far different next year no matter what happens. I don’t think it will be hard to keep who Dean wants to really keep but without getting into the number breakdown, I’ll put players in order of who stays, who will likely stay and who is soon to be a former King.
Stays in LA
Rob Scuderi
Slava Voynov
Jordan Nolan
Kyle Clifford
Alec Martinez
Likely to stay may lose one
Trevor Lewis
Alec Martinez
Jake Muzzin
Brad Richardson
Adios muchachos
Davis Drewiske
Dustin Penner
Keaton Ellerby
Jonathan Bernier
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Neil Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:06 pm
@Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com), Depends on how many players come up…Toffili for sure. If Pearson comes up(to start) then one more player would have to be lost.Also if the Kings amnesty anyone..Dont think they will but you never know….
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variable Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:10 pm
@Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com),
as usual, we are primarily on the same page with our choices…and format…:)
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Shiny Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:22 pm
@Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com), I dunno, they’ve put a crapload of effort and work into their D-men so I think Marty, VV, Scuds, and Muzzin stay for sure. It’s likely Mr. Ellerby will be leaving us at the end of the season along with Penner, who had taken a paycut to stay with the defending SC champions; can’t see him staying for another year. Not sure about Richardson but he’ll probably leave, too.
There’s such an emphasis on D, that’s why I think most of our defense guys stay.
And unless we get a goalie, I think DL will try to extend Bernie’s contract for another year.
But I’m no GM, so we’ll have to see what gets decided in 2 months
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Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com) Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:27 pm
@Shiny, Plus, there are so many things that can happen between then and now that could change everything. Also, I think we have to consider the possible loss of Mitchell leaving our D that much younger.
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Shiny Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:29 pm
@Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com), losing him to retirement or permanent injury? God I hope neither happens.
But you are absolutely correct, we have no idea what can happen between now and the end of the.season that may or may not change things.
Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com) Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:34 pm
I hope not but he’ll be 36 in April. That knee isn’t getting any younger.
Kings20 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:45 pm
@Shiny, Why is everybody so down on Ellerby. I thing this kid deserves a chance. Since he join the Kings our goals against down, he does play very physical game, something that was missing and he is a plus defensively. All this kid needs a confidence boost, let him know that he is part of this team and he might surprise some people.
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Kingsfanforlife Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:12 pm
@Kings20, I think Ellerby has fit himself in nicely and doing a great job, I say he’s a keeper
jet Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:17 pm
@Kings20, He is learning fast, but he is also miles behind on basic plays. He will still look to play the puck to center ice and give up possesion rather than play it behind his net to the other Dman. For years, I watch TM’s repetitive drills slowing adding pressure during camps, while thinking to myself these guys got it, move on. But, that repition of the basics again and again has set our youth defenders apart. While Ellerby has good attributes to work with, we have to ask if he is too far behind in basic training to be a King defenceman.
I have many family members back east that continually ask me how we are winning with 4 defencemen with so little experience. The answer is that their basic play is so strong.
PRMan Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:36 pm
@Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com), I don’t think there’s any way we let Ellerby leave. We got him specifically to be a guard as a potential Top 4 in the wake of Greene and/or Mitchell leaving.
DL talked about him being a project that has the potential to be a Top 4 replacement for a guy like Greene.
Stays in LA
Rob Scuderi (Both parties already talking extension)
Kyle Clifford (Market won’t be too high for him anyway, no real pressure)
Alec Martinez (No way we lose him)
Keaton Ellerby (Projected Greene replacement next year)
Jake Muzzin (Top 4 potential)
Questionable
Slava Voynov (Unless he gets megabucks in Russia, which is highly likely)
Jonathan Bernier (We could potentially get a #1 pick for him at the deadline, if someone goes down and gets desperate)
Jordan Nolan (Dime a dozen, buy may sign for minimum increase)
Trevor Lewis (Dime a dozen, would rather see a youngster with some upside, then again, his defensive play is top-notch, so his value here is probably higher than elsewhere)
Adios muchachos
Davis Drewiske (His good play this season probably gets him a raise we aren’t comfortable with)
Dustin Penner (Too streaky and too expensive. See ya.)
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PRMan Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:37 pm
@PRMan, Oh, and Richardson, no chance.
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BillAnthony Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 7:36 pm
@PRMan, Teams that sustain success over time don’t make the mistake of weakening their strengths because they think they can afford to do so. The Kings’ strengths last year and when they’ve turned in up a notch this year have been goaltending, forecheck, and penalty kill. He’s no world class offensive talent, but Lewis is a proven factor in two of those strengths.
Besides, any guy that scores two twice in a Kings Stanley Cup clinching game can never be called dime a dozen! LOL.
Duncanz Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:56 pm
@PRMan, One thing people forget when they peg guys with the dime-a-dozen tag or such is their contribution to team chemistry and experience and knowledge of the team system.
Lose too many of your role players and you would see the difficulty with fitting in and familiarizing a significant group of new players.
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Gretzky to Kurri Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:37 pm
@Duncanz,
Exactly. There is a reason you dress 18 skaters a night. Especially this team. The third and fourth are not just a jumble of leftover guys, as I get the feel for on some teams. Teams like that are not in contention for the Cup either. The chemistry and system are very important here. Those “dime a dozen” guys were brought up to know how to play Kings hockey.
Osaka Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:39 pm
@Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com), I guess it all pedends on the returns of Martinez, Mitchell, and Greener. If those three come back healthy and playing well, would you go with the young guys who are playing now and let Scuds go? Also the price to resign Scuds is a factor.
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Kings20 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:48 pm
@Osaka, Yes i would let Scuds go, but not for free. Via trade yes.
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CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:55 pm
@Kings20, You would have to trade him before this season’s trade deadline, which will not happen.
Kingsfanforlife Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:13 pm
@Kings20, Ya, we can’t afford to lose Scuds this season with all the other D’s out. He’s the backbone of our D right now….
*Martinez in the ‘likely’ category only
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Duncanz Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:14 pm
@Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com),
Martinez stays.
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Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com) Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:18 pm
@Duncanz, I hope so but if push comes to shove on salary, Muzzin will be cheaper and may have a higher ceiling in the eyes of Deano. Muzzin is in a perfect position to really make a name for himself.
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CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:50 pm
@Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com), Yup, Martinez is expendable if Muzzin plays well.
Quisp Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 8:58 pm
@Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com),
Mitchell’s days are probably numbered. Muzzin may well replace Greene on the third pair. Martinez isn’t going anywhere.
this is where the good gm’s rise to the top – after success, how do you sustain long-term competitiveness…(?)
dl has got some tough decisions ahead to make…
imo…players who won’t be re-signed…:
penner
richardson
players that are on the fence…:
lewis
nolan
ellerby
drewiske
players that should be re-signed…:
scuderi
clifford
martinez
voynov
muzzin
and then there’s bernier…at this point, i really don’t know what will happen…my guess is that he will be traded after the season, at the very least ,his negotiating rights will be available…but jb is so talented and making it an extremely tough decision for dl and the kings…
his stock only goes up with every win…tonight,jb has another chance to show what he can do against one of the perennial top nhl teams…
send in the scouts…
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Duncanz Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:15 pm
@variable, +1
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Neil Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:15 pm
@variable, If you trade Bernier the Kings will need to get a player whose contract is lower or prospects/draft picks…..
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Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com) Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:24 pm
@variable,
Richardson seems like a throw away but I don’t think he’ll get any offers and Dean loves his versatility. I see him probably staying unless the Kings don’t even make him an offer. Why get rid of him?
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variable Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:29 pm
@Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com),
richardson…:
i just think he becomes the new peter harrold of the team – very versatile, but can’t stay in the lineup for long stretches of time…he becomes more expendable if a prospect shines during next year’s training camp…
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CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:36 pm
@Paul Armbruster (KingsNewsDaily.com), Only because his cap hit is going to higher than what a replacement players cap hit would be. I think Cliche is destined for that reserve forward spot next season. His cap hit is only 525,000. I don’t think Richardson will take that kind of a pay cut just to stay on a team in which he never plays.
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variable Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:38 pm
@CB14,
that’s an intriguing situation – cliche…
CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:40 pm
@variable, I can’t see anyway Nolan is not brought back. His lack of experience, and scoring numbers, means his cap hit won’t increase very much. So replacing him with a player from Manchester won’t help the Kings cap situation a whole lot.
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variable Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:46 pm
@CB14,
i think nolan’s play the rest of the way will determine his future with the club…
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xeropoint Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:18 pm
@CB14, There’s not much reason to let him walk. Qualify him and you’re still near his minimal salary. Negligible difference. I’m surprised some haven’t suggested moving Stoll. He has a trade able deal and worth for a team looking for a good 3rd center. Richards can handle that spot, if need be and there’s another 3.5M. Although I wouldn’t look to trade him until after this season.
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CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:44 pm
@xeropoint, I did a little lower, as you might have guessed.
It makes the most sense because of what you said regarding Carter and Richards.
Osaka Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:40 pm
@variable, Except there really isn’t a market for goalies now.
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variable Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:47 pm
@Osaka,
there’s always a market for a burgeoning, upstart, hyped-out goalie, like jb is…
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yetiman_oc Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:28 pm
@variable, if JB continues to play like he has in his starts this year (and he gets enough to prove he can be consistent) don’t be surprised if it is JQ who gets traded. with his style of play, JQ has to be physically fit to be on top of his game. he already has a back problem. if JB gets a chance to show that he has what DL thought when he drafted him, his style of play may make him the better long term option for the kings.
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keith Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 5:15 pm
@yetiman_oc, totally agree. I really like JB.
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Quisp Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 9:00 pm
@variable,
Nolan isn’t on the fence, I don’t think. And Lewis is Sutter’s favorite player. Stoll will be gone before Lewis.
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Osaka Reply:
February 28th, 2013 at 3:00 am
@Quisp, Yep. Lewis is being groomed to the the younger cheeper Stoll.
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At some point this team will not have many boxes to fill for a few years.At that point the Kings may need to trade to open up some spots or trade for future draft picks….Players like Lewis/Cliffy gives the Kings alot for what they are getting paid.The way to win now is to get high value at under value prices…Kings look good for the future…
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Voynov is #1 priority. 5M sounds about right.
Cliffy and Marty are good for 1.8-2.2M max. They still haven’t proven themselves to be Top 6/4, though Cliffy is having a good showing this year. I think both of their games have quite a ways to mature still.
Lewis/Nolan/Muzz/Ellerby are replaceable with young guns from Manchester on EL deals or trades unless they don’t break 1.2-1.5M each.
Bernier is already on the chopping block, Not sure his cap is a concern unless something happens to Quick.
As much as I like Penner, his 3.5M cap hit needs to make room. That would free up room for Scuds and possibly a shot at Whisky resigning to maintain some consistency on the blueline.
Let Richie go to FA.
What is the cap discount on Greene and Mitchell for LTIR?
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King John Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:33 pm
@Jeremy, No, Lewis and Nolan stay. Muzzin will be part of our future D corps.
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Token Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 6:41 pm
@Jeremy, no way Voynov gets more than Subban $$ off of an ELC. $3M would be generous.
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Quisp Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 9:02 pm
@Token,
Agreed. The only thing that makes Voynov not a typical RFA is that the “bolt for the KHL” problem is real. But he’s still not going to get Jack Johnson UFA money.
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Reference the UFA’s, I hate to say it, but Penner, Richardson and Drewiske will be gone. Scuds gets signed for 2 years with a slight pay raise. VV gets a 4-5 year deal at 3.5 per year. Clifford and Martinez each get 3-4 year deals at 1.5 to 2 per year. Depending on his current cap hit and what he might ask for, Ellerby stays for 1-1.5, same with Lewis, Muzzin and Nolan, with 2-3 deals. Bernier doesn’t get an extension, but gets traded to someone for draft picks and we find a veteran as a back up for 1-1.5 on a 2 year deal. This puts you at the $15 mil mark. Penner at $3.2, DD2 at .8 and Richardson at $1.5 equals $5.5 which leaves DL a little room to add to the above signing amounts. Just my opinion. For free. Or nachos. Hey DL, I’m available. Call me. Lets do lunch.
[Reply]
Bye bye Penner. His salary doesn’t match his contribution, and he can probably easily be replaced by an AHLer making a fraction of Penner does (for now anyway). Subtract 3.25, add probably 0.750. Bernier is gone, and his replacement probably won’t be making more money than he is. Subtract 1.25, add 0.800. Richardson is gone, AHL replacement. Subtract 1.125, add .600. What was 5.625 is now 2.15. I don’t see Voynov getting more than 3 per, unless he point production hits another level at some point this season. At 5.15 now. Clifford and Lewis will probably pull in a combined 2.25 taking us to 7.4. Nolan gets a small raise, .750, at 8.15. Martinez takes about 1, 9.15. Ellerby and Muzzin take in 1.75 combined, 10.9. Scuds 3.5, 14.4. Drewiske gone, but replaced by same salary.
Seems reasonable to me!
[Reply]
i d k…
how do some of yoots suggest that voynov is worth $5mil per year at this point…(???)…
i seriously doubt we sign slava for any more than $3mil per…with the possibility that if he signs for the max, 8 years, he could get as high as approx. $4.2 mil annually, (based upon a $3mil per AAV)…
why…?
well, read the CBA…:
“Salary variance: No more than 35 percent year-over-year and no year less than 50 percent of the highest year.”
here’s a good link breaking it down…:
http://espn.go.com/blog/nhl/post/_/id/21176/breaking-down-the-nhls-new-cba
[Reply]
LB Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:38 pm
@variable, He’ll probably get what Jack Johnson got, what was it about $4.5 million per year?
[Reply]
variable Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:42 pm
@LB,
$4,357,143 per year until 2018, to be exact…
…and i thought that was a bit much for jmfj, too…
[Reply]
LB Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:47 pm
@variable, But isn’t that a logical argument to make if you’re Voynov’s agent? Voynov replaced Johnson and many believe that he’s better than Johnson. He has the same offensive stats without the defensive concerns. I think he should get something close to what Jack got on a long term deal.
CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:46 pm
@LB, I don’t think he gets as much as JJ did. There are many factors that contribute to what a player gets in his next contract. One of those is the amount of experiencce that player has. JJ had over 4 years of NHL experience when his contract kicked in. VV will only have 1 and a half years. Another thing is what that player made in his prior contract. JJ’s previous cap number was 1,425,000. VV’s is only 816,000.
[Reply]
LB Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:49 pm
@CB14, then maybe a short term 2 year deal, at $3 or 3.5 mil and then a chance to sign a long term deal in two years.
CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:53 pm
@LB, That makes the most sense.
variable Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:57 pm
@LB,
i have to agree with CB14 on this issue…although they are similar, their career earnings paths are drastically different form one another…jmfj was touted early on as a franchise player…and he continues to get paid for his potential…slava, although picked 32nd overall in 2008, wasn’t nearly hyped as jmfj was…unfortunately, hype sometimes blurs true value…and in this case, slava doesn’t benefit as much to being compared to jmfj…
if anything that voynov has going for him that resembles jmfj’s career is that they both have tons ‘o’ international play experience…and that could help him in the negotiating process…
[Reply]
Quisp Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 9:03 pm
@variable,
your CBA quote only applies to deals that meet the definition of front-loaded. Otherwise the old rule applies.
[Reply]
For giggles:
Voynov – $3.3M
Scuds – $3.3M
AMart – $1.2M
Clifford – $1.2M
Nolan – $.7M
Muzz – $.7M
Lewis – $.8M
DD2 – $.8M
Bernier – $1.5M
Total $13.5M
Penner, Richardson, Ellerby gone, replaced by EL contracts for rookies.
[Reply]
King John Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:36 pm
@vplaza,
Bring Doughty down to 6 mil to free up another million. Would he do it?
I knew when we signed him for that much it would haunt us in the future.
The guy didn’t realize his greed then endangered having the right teammates down the line.
[Reply]
CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:38 pm
@King John, He would never do it. Even if he wanted to, his agent, and the Players Association, wouldn’t allow him to do it.
[Reply]
LB Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:40 pm
@King John, you can’t restructure contracts in the NHL like in football, can you?
[Reply]
vplaza Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:18 pm
@King John,
I don’t think restructuring is possible under the CBA.
[Reply]
Quisp Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 9:04 pm
@King John,
can’t renegotiate contracts.
[Reply]
Shiny Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:37 pm
@vplaza, you’re underpaying Bernie and Scuds. Scuds is at about $3.4 mil/year and to stay, he’ll need a raise. I just don’t know if DL can literally afford to match an offer sheet if Scuds decides to test the waters of free agency, but we’ll see
DL has a way with words it seems
[Reply]
vplaza Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:18 pm
@Shiny,
I know a lot of people value JB quite a bit and he is certainly a very capable goaltender. But, the reality is that he doesn’t have a ton of games under his belt as a starter, so is it realistic to think that he would get more than $1.8M, which is what Quick had before he got his new contract?
I mean, it took Quick a trip to the Olympics, the playoffs, and ultimately, the Cup and the Conn Smythe to get his big payday. Is it feasible or even reasonable to think that JB would command such a huge raise given that he hasn’t really accomplished that much? Does a team sign him to an offer sheet of $2M-$3M based on potential?
Maybe I’m the one who’s severely undervaluing him.
[Reply]
CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:41 pm
@vplaza, I think 1.8 for JB sounds about right. It’s possible a needy team looks to offer sheet JB. The Kings wouldn’t be able to match the offer and keep him because of Salary cap concerns, but they could match it and look to trade him.
vplaza Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:50 pm
@CB14,
I guess there may be teams desperate out there for a starting goaltender, so if he does get to be a starter, then $1.8M may be on the low end. But I still say that it would be difficult for someone to offer him starter money right off the bat when he doesn’t have that many games as a starter.
Of course, the Quacks gave Fasth $2.9M after he went on a hot streak, so it’s very possible JB will be gone.
variable Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:43 pm
@vplaza,
i don’t see how we could sign jb for only $1.5mil…and scuds will prob get a few hundred thousand more per year…
otherwise, not a bad forecast….:)
[Reply]
vplaza Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:14 pm
@variable,
I think it was more wishful thinking on JB, but who knows. As far as Scuds, if he gets $3.5 or 3.6, I’d probably be okay with it, but maybe he gives a hometown discount at this stage of his career to stay?
[Reply]
DD2, Richardson, Ellerby, and Penner are all gone. The rest of the RFA’s are all brought back. Some of the re-signed RFA’s might be traded, (AM and TL), because they’re not core players and their cap hits will be higher than replacement players would be.
Scuds is the difficult one. It really depends on what Dean feels like doing. Personally, I would only bring Scuds back if WM and MG were both not healthy at the end of the season. If DL wants Scuds back regardless, then that likely means either Stoll or Williams, mabye both, are moved in the off-season. It would be extremely tight, if not impossible, to bring Scuds back at his current cap hit without trading a player with a cap hit above 3 million.
I think you’re being a little generous with suggesting VV will get between 3 and 5 million. At this point I don’t see VV getting more than 3 million per year, but I guess if his play continues to improve this season then it’s a possibility.
[Reply]
KC23 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:03 pm
@CB14, Bernier will be gone … after the season that is. We’ll need a back up goal tender on the cheap.
[Reply]
KC23 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:04 pm
@KC23, I agree with you about VV. I was thinking between 2 and 3 a year at best, but for 5 years.
[Reply]
CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:23 pm
@KC23, I forgot about Bernier. I agree with you, he will be gone in the off-season.
[Reply]
FKA PakiFro Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:06 pm
@CB14,
I thought the same thing. Stoll may be gone The Kings are still deep at center with Vey in the wings. But if you move Stoll, keeping Richardson would be more of a priority because he can fill in temporarily if Vey struggles. Given Lombardi’s focus on strength in the middle, I’d think Williams would be moved first…or dare I say it..Willie Mitchell gets moved because the young guys now are showing a lot.
[Reply]
CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:34 pm
@FKA PakiFro, I think Richardson will want to move on to somewhere he can get some playing time. The choice between Stoll and Williams is a tough one. Personally I’d keep Williams. If Vey struggles you could always move Carter to Center. Plus Lewis can fill in there as well. I don’t think Mitchell will get moved. I think DL would simply let Scuds walk rather than re-sign Scuds and trade Mitchell.
[Reply]
FKA PakiFro Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:45 pm
@CB14,
I think Mitchell has a slight edge in play, but his durability is an issue. No doubt, some serious tough decisions coming up. I’d like to see them do their best and go for it this season because next year might have less depth
CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:56 pm
@FKA PakiFro, I agree. Fortunately it seems like the rest of the top teams will have less depth next season too.
This is the way I see it:
Must Keep
Clifford
Lewis
Nolan
Voynov
Prefer to Keep
Martinez
Scuderi
Could Take it or leave it
Richardson
Muzzin
Drewiske
Ellerby
Trade
Bernier
Not worth it
Penner
Thoughts:
Clifford is just going to get better.
Lewis may never be a 20 goal scorer or even a 15 goal scorer but he does a lot on the defensive end and you need that. Voynov MUST be signed.
Nolan will probably never play on anything but a 4th line but his role is still very important.
Guys like Scuderi are hard to replace. At the same time, if we can’t afford him we still have some depth and prospects there 1 or 2 of which should make the team.
I’d still live to keep Bernier as insurance but that is unrealistic. Better to get something for him than have to pay a lot for a backup, albeit a very good one.
[Reply]
Shiny Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:41 pm
@HockeyNerd, DL is very fair to players. Bernie never specifically came right our and asked for a trade, he just wants to play. He’s got enough talent and skill that some team will pay a lot to make him their #1 like he deserves to be. I think Bernie gets traded at the end of the season for a high draft pick and he’ll acquire a decent backup goalie for Quick. Otherwise, Bernier needs to stay.
[Reply]
Gonna sound like a heretic here. I say let Scuderi go. I love him, but he ain’t gettin’ any younger. Doughty, Voynov, Mitchell, Martinez, Greene, Muzzin and Ellerby is a good 7-man D Corp. That 3.5 mil Scuderi is making can be used toward those guys who are due a pay raise. Also, Penner walks. I like him well enough, but a guy like Toffoli or Pearson or Vey can contribute just as much and for less of a cap burden. Use that extra money for the raises due to Lewis, Clifford and Nolan.
[Reply]
LB Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:42 pm
@Stoneknite, and what if Mitchell can’t play anymore? or not at the same level? It’s certainly seems like a possibility at this point.
[Reply]
Kings20 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:59 pm
@Stoneknite, 100% Agree!!!!!!
[Reply]
I was told there would be no math on this blog…
[Reply]
Some of you guys just want to destroy the whole team chemistry by arbitrarily saying we don’t need this or that player. You better be careful who you don’t resign—and I think DL will be careful. We want to keep as many of the players we have now as we can. Remember, they’re a STANLEY CUP WINNING TEAM, and it’s hard to get just the right ingredients to mix together to do that.
[Reply]
puck73 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:48 pm
@King John, 100% correct in my book, Give this man a Cuban
[Reply]
DesertKing Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:56 pm
@puck73,
I agree with him also, but why whould he want Mark Cuban around?
[Reply]
jess Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:59 pm
@puck73, atta boy
[Reply]
CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:53 pm
@King John, Of course we do, but that’s not possible with the Salary Cap being what it is next season. Feel free to give us some numbers to re-sign all those free agents and still fit under the salary cap.
[Reply]
Duncanz Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:11 pm
@CB14, I see what he wrote as a counterpoint to all the texas dump ‘em card sharps around who enjoy shuffling and dealing more than they do holding on to a proven winning hand.
[Reply]
King John Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:30 pm
@Duncanz, EXACTLY!
jess Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:57 pm
@King John,
hear hear!! +1000
[Reply]
KC23 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:02 pm
@King John, Nah, look what it did for the Rangers? … errr, wait … never mind.
[Reply]
variable Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:05 pm
@King John,
i don’t see how making the necessary changes on the roster…both due to salary cap restrictions and player performance…is a terrible thing to do…in fact, i hope that dl is as proactive as the lamoriellos and hollands of the league…those guys have a proven track record of making smart deals every year that make the team better and/or more competitive…
i think you can easily fall in love eith the personalities of players when yr team becomes successful…i’m not trying to diminish the human element of constructing a bonafide contending team…however, it comes down to dollars and sense…and in order to stay relevant in this ultra-competitive league, a gm has to do what they need to do, regardless of their personal feelings ab out the player…
[Reply]
So many experts have been spoken yet none of them convinced me. VV for 5 mil is laughable. And it’s not about how they do individually but the total dynamics of the team. Keep wasting your time.
[Reply]
jet Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:33 pm
@goldielocks, I think that is for 3 years
[Reply]
HockeyNerd Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:34 pm
@goldielocks,
1. Take a look at Doughty’s stats right now, particularly his +/-.
2. Take a look at Voynov’s numbers.
3. Look up how much DD makes per season.
4. Now explain your statement.
[Reply]
vplaza Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:46 pm
@HockeyNerd,
So, DD is now being judged the same way that JMFJ had been judged around here? By his plus/minus stat? So, just by that, Souray, Beauchemin, Seguin and Mark Fraser should get $5M? Those guys are leading the league in that stat as of today.
[Reply]
HockeyNerd Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:14 pm
@vplaza, I agree, +/- numbers do not tell the whole story and can be very misleading. My point was and is that Voynov is having a much better year than Doughty so far and it is not a stretch to think he will turn out to be the better of the 2. In that light $5M for him is far from inconceivable. That was the point I was trying to make. I don’t know and don’t care what other teams are paying the players you brought up and I don’t see what that has to do with it.
vplaza Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:24 pm
@HockeyNerd,
The reason I brought up other players is because these guys don’t get paid in a vacuum. It’s always in the context of more than just stats compared to someone on their team. So, it makes no sense to say that VV is worth $5M because he is dong better than DD who is making $7M.
And while you may not know or care about what other teams pay their players, DL is not going to overpay someone when compared to their peers. So, how many players who have played less than two full seasons who aren’t “elite” players have received a $5M salary? That’s what I’m saying.
HockeyNerd Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:51 pm
@vplaza, You’re missing the reason I responded to this post in the first place. I’m not trying to argue that VV is worth $5M or that that is what he is worth simply because of what Doughty gets. The original post said paying VV 5M was “laughable”. You’re looking at a potential situation, and granted I am using the word potential, where by the time DL has to negotiate VV will have accomplished the same or more as DD in almost the same period of time AS DD. IF that happens, and I agree it’s an IF but not an entirely unrealistic one, how is the 5 Mil laughable? Maybe still somewhat overpriced, but certainly not laughable. I did not use that word. I am responding to it.
vplaza Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 5:01 pm
@HockeyNerd,
Hmm, I re-read the post and your first reply to it and I must have missed something because it sure seemed like your response was to say that VV worth $5M is not laughable because of how VV is doing in comparison to DD.
So are you simply saying that VV will have accomplished more THIS SEASON compared to DD and thus, $5M is not laughable? Because even if VV scored more goals, points, and higher plus/minus than DD this season, I still think it would be laughable to say he’s worth $5M. And when you take it into the context of VV’s peers (like I tried to do in my first reply), it becomes even more laughable.
Of course, that’s just my opinion.
HockeyNerd Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 5:10 pm
@vplaza, You’re putting words in my mouth.
Once more:
1. By the end of the season it is not a stretch to think that VV will have accomplished more in his first couple if seasons than DD did in his. I am NOT saying it will or won’t happen, just that it is certainly a REASONABLE possibility.
2. Therefore it is not LAUGHABLE to suggest VV would either be worth or get 5 million.
That’s ALL I’m saying. Nothing more.
vplaza Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 5:18 pm
@HockeyNerd,
First off, this is all in good spirits, so rest assured, I’m not trying to pick a fight or anytyhing.
Second, you’ll probably need to rethink #1. In his second season, DD was a Norris Trophy candidate and then went to the Olympics where he shined. He was voted the team’s outstanding defenseman for the first three years in LA. So, unless VV is a Norris candidate this year and goes to Sochi and wins a medal next year, I don’t think that one can reasonably say that VV will have accomplished more than DD in the first parts of their careers.
Of course, you may think that VV might, but that would be a pretty big stretch, IMHO.
goldielocks Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 5:33 pm
@HockeyNerd,
Speak to me again when Voynov nominated as a Norris candidate. So far nobody mentioned his name.
[Reply]
Well, as usual I see a lot of speculation on here which is par for the course when a subject like this comes up, so here’s my thoughts:
1.) Season ain’t over yet.
2.) When DL makes a move, you won’t even see coming and about 90% of these predictions will be out in left field.
3.) Bernier isn’t going anywhere until DL is comfortable with someone to take his place, and Bernier’s don’t grow on trees.
[Reply]
DesertKing Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:57 pm
@jess,
Reference #3, not even in Quebec?
[Reply]
jess Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:00 pm
@DesertKing, I don’t know, -is it even goaltender growing season yet?
[Reply]
DesertKing Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:01 pm
@jess,
I think Patrick Roy came from a tree.
jess Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:05 pm
@DesertKing,
When in net, -he certainly jumped out in front of ya like a tree
variable Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 2:59 pm
@jess,
how is yr speculation any different than the rest of us…(?)
that’s what we all do – speculate – around here…:)
[Reply]
jess Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:02 pm
@variable,
Ah well I’ve watched DL pretty closely. From my observation, he doesn’t do random impulsive moves based on emotion. To summarize, he knows when to hold’em and when to fold’em better than the finest poker player.
[Reply]
DesertKing Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:06 pm
@jess,
He’s like a ninja GM. You never see him until its too late. Or HockeyFest. Or the playoffs. Or the Stanley Cup celebration. Or an Insider interview.
Duncanz Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:18 pm
@jest, Darn you, you preempted my not-so-ace poker analogy!
You are almost better at this stuff …
than @SVELTEY …
Okay, thanks Jon … now I’m really depressed.
I knew there was a reason I was on the players side during the lock out. Fricken owners. We are gonna lose some very good players, but what can you do?
[Reply]
DesertKing Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:04 pm
@KC23,
Get new ones who are cheaper and better. It is the cycle of professional sports. I didn’t get a DD jersey until I was sure he would sign a long term contract and wouldn’t get traded.
[Reply]
KC23 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:09 pm
@DesertKing, I never ever get a players name on my jerseys. To this day virtually everybody thinks I wear 23 because of Brown, but it actually because of my original favorite King player when I was 12 years old … Eddie “The Entertainer” Shack
I was in a resturant after the Kings game last week and some older guy saw my 23 and said something about Dustin’s game … I said this 23 is for a player named Eddie Shack … turned out the guy was about my age and from Toronto in which Eddie was on the last team that won the cup in Toronto. You can bet he was expecting that from a King’s fan.
[Reply]
DesertKing Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:19 pm
@KC23,
100%! Leaving Oakland Coliseum last season, some youngster behind me saw my #12 Stabler jersey and made the comment “Who the F is “Stabler?” Needless to say, I stopped, as did many Raider fans on the bridge, and after he got his 3 minute lesson on who Ken Stabler was and what he meant to the Raider history, I think he ran off and became a Charger fan. True Kings fans like your self are what make being a Kings fan special, but unfortunatley the great days where you identified a team by its players is disappearing due to free agency. I almost think the Charteuse Flings were the last team to maintain a core stable of long term players and now that they have all left, that team is in trouble. DL has set us up for a good core stable group of terrific players, similar to what Detroit has done in the past, so maybe we will become a dynasty team that people identify, similar to the showtime Lakers and the Garvey/Cey/Lopes Dodger era.
jet Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:37 pm
@KC23, uhh, his nickname on the ice was “the entertainer”, but off the ice it was “love”
The real question is who are we trading to get Purcell, Moulson, Parse, Harrold, Gagne, Simmonds and Schenn back.
On a side note @ADAM M, I apologized on the previous thread man. Not sure if you are aware, but I was being sarcastic with you and we are all on the same team…..except for Duncanz and his alter ego Phil sykes. haha
[Reply]
DesertKing Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:22 pm
@Lake Forest,
Just had to go back and read that thread. Classic! I think @jess nailed it best, but just in case, I called my brother and he told me to forget hockey, start following the exciting sport of power broom curling. Never listen to your brother!
[Reply]
jet Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:39 pm
@DesertKing, Hey, 5 or 6 years ago Hammond was trying to get us to go throw his stones.
[Reply]
Duncanz Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:29 pm
@Loose Flippest,
slight housekeeping poin heret … dude …. i am @phil sykes alter ego ….. so if you don t like it dude …… just forget it …… i ve been following hockey for longer than any other clown on this website ………. why are all you peeps so arrogant …….tonight i will haunt you all in your dreams and on your screens …….cos im awesome ………….. get used to it all you peeps out there …………idiots …………just kiddin………no bipolarity here ……..we can all get along here ……….and not get other peeps moderated ….. like what hammond did to peeps every flogging 6 seconds!!!!! ………….right?????
[Reply]
jet Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:40 pm
@Duncanz, that was good, can you do Sutter?
[Reply]
Duncanz Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:29 pm
@jet, Not really. You weren’t here last season, right?
You just got to come out every night and check as good as you can, and if you do that and check every night you might get the results. If you can check hard a lot sometimes it makes the difference but it’s all the same really, there’s nothing different. Checking gets results wherever you are and if you miss it the first time you just try and check again later and see what ends up on the boards. It’s just simple math when you think about it really, right?
Does anyone feel like i do? I wish we could trade Doughty. He is not worth 7 million. No goals and -10. Worst on team
[Reply]
Duncanz Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:34 pm
@KingsOfKomedy, There was a guy I think named 7Milforhickey that used to rear up around here ……
Like his proletarian semi-namesake for the NYI this season, he had some good points!
[Reply]
CB14 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:35 pm
@KingsOfKomedy, I’m sure @BamaKings fan does.
[Reply]
Gustavo Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:35 pm
@KingsOfKomedy,
I do not. If you only measure goals or points, then get rid of Kopi, not Doughty. Doughty plays the longest minutes. This short season DD’s production is not going to be neasured by goals only.
[Reply]
vplaza Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:38 pm
@KingsOfKomedy,
Ummm, no. Do I think he’s worth $7M? Not exactly, but you’re not going to find someone remotely close to what he does for you night in and night out, at both ends of the ice for any less money. You may find someone good at one thing for less, but not the complete package.
He may be underachieving this year on the offensive side and had stretches where he’s struggled defensively, but this kid is a real talent that you will regret losing down the road if you trade him now. He has too much upside to have this continue and should turn it around eventually.
I was one of those who was vocal about my displeasure with the whole contract negotiation thing and I still think that it hurt the team early on. I also think that it has somewhat hampered the Kings with what they can do with other players. BUT, I think it’s unwise to think that he should be traded because of his plus/minus. That would be very shortsighted, IMHO.
[Reply]
jess Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:41 pm
@KingsOfKomedy,
Uhhh.
No.
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HockeyNerd Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:43 pm
@KingsOfKomedy, You wish we COULD trade Doughty? I think what you meant was you wish DL WOULD trade Doughty. Do you really think some GM, say the other 29 of them wouldn’t be salivating at the prospect?
Yes he is having a bad start. Some of that is because he is getting much more ice time than he would normally due to the injuries. That +/- is nasty but mark my words it’ll be a + by the end of the season.
Incidentally, did you not watch him in last years playoffs?
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jet Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 3:44 pm
@KingsOfKomedy, There would not be enough interest to get the right price this year. As I mentioned at the top, there will be very good free agents available this summer
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HockeyNerd Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:53 pm
@jet, In Doughty?
Seriously, what are you guys smoking?
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jet Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 6:27 pm
@HockeyNerd, Look, the clubs who would pay the most for him are cutting payroll by 15% this off season. If you are going to trade him, why would you not wait until next year when you could have a bidding war. The difference could be 2 1st v 3 firsts, worth the wait.
Restricted Free Agents
Kyle Clifford $1.2 mill
Trevor Lewis $1.5 mill
Jordan Nolan $900K
Slava Voynov $2.50 mill
Alec Martinez $1.20 mill
Keaton Ellerby $750K
Jake Muzzin $650K
Jonathan Bernier Traded for picks or D-man
Unrestricted Free Agents
Rob Scuderi $3.0 mill
Dustin Penner Do not re-sign
Brad Richardson Do not re-sign
Davis Drewiske $1.2 mill
Total $11,950,000
Spare Change $3,090,000 to sign a backup goalie + promote 1 or 2 kids from Manchester.
Nothing to worry about.
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Michael J. Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:07 pm
@Gustavo,
The Kings will need to promote two from Manchester, right? Any of Vey, Toffoli or Pearson will be due around $900K each, which leaves only $1M for a good backup goalie, right?
I think Lewie might sign for a little less, maybe $1.25M
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Gustavo Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:49 pm
@Michael J.,
None of those 3 will make more than their NHL contract of $550K or so as rookies. I think there is about $2.0 mill for a backup goalie.
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This is what you end up with when a selfish Ontario-born right shooting defenseman and his greedy agent hold the team for ransom. Scuds will not be re-signed; the Kings won’t be able to affored him. Or, we can say goodbye to JW as he will be traded for picks.
That contract will be a millstone around the club’s neck for six more years.
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Duncanz Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:10 pm
@7figuresforMichael J., You talking about Bray Bourquety?
With his projected perennial Norris status I don’t think we have anything to worry about here..
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vplaza Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:20 pm
@Duncanz,
I think he meant Brad Doty.
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Let’s see, my predictions would be:
Voynov stays obviously
Scuderi leaves, with all our lower price d men in system we opt cheaper route
Bernier traded (I think Carolina should go for him) he doesn’t want to be backup
Martinez I think he could be traded, but if not he stays
Lewis stays
Clifford stays
Penner for sure gone
Muzzin brought back
Depending on injuries to Greene Mitchell and the Martinez situation, either one or none of drewiske and ellerby stays, probably drewiske
I’d like to see Richardson back, but he could certainly find minutes elsewhere and is probably gone
Nolan probably stays but has no guarantee of spot in line up
I also believe Williams could be traded
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Kings714 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:09 pm
@Kings714, voynov muzzin and Lewis seem the most sure thing decisions IMO.
Voynov self explanatory
Lewis is a shutter favorite and versatile
And all signs point to muzzin being leaned on for the future
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Oh, how I love playing devils advocate. Everyone says Penner is gone. He took a huge pay cut to come back. Who says it would not happen again? He has already chased the big money in Edmonton, and his streaky play will certainly reduce the number of suitors. SoCal seems to agree with him, and unless San Jose comes calling, offering the chance to become the first player to have a ring from all three Cal. teams, you might just see him next fall.
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vplaza Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 4:38 pm
@edwood2,
While that’s an interesting way to look at it, let’s look at it more. He took a $1M pay cut to stay this year. Even if he took another $1M next year, that’s still $2.25M tied up to him, which essentially eats up all of the money you could have for EL contracts for nearly three players.
I mean, he’d have to take a MASSIVE pay cut, IMHO, for the Kings to keep him. And as you said, his streaky play makes it hard to commit that type of money to him. Maybe if he started the year strong and maintained it, it might be a stronger argument. But the guy is definitely a “you’re not sure which player you’re going to get tonight” type of player.
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kings714 Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 5:48 pm
@edwood2, even with a paycut, in house options like clifford, lewis, king, pearson or toffoli can fill the hole for much cheaper and likely match his production. he makes way too much money for only having proved himself in short stretches in LA. teams with less talent will jump at a player like him, but for who we already have he becomes expendable. only at 1.5 mil or less would it make sense for us, and that wouldn’t make sense for him, he could probably pull 2.5-3 elsewhere
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I apparently am the only person that hates Martinez. That guy is Joe Corvo 2.0.
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vplaza Reply:
February 27th, 2013 at 5:03 pm
@tkecanuck341,
Sure looks like you are.
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Trevor Lewis:Defensive play is top-notch & Kings’chemistry and system in him made this guy a high asset to keep,#2 priority…I talk…You see…GKG…
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This new cap ceiling is BS!!! Its really gonna hurt the team. These guys have to get resigned
Scuderi
Voynov
Kyle Clifford
Trevor Lewis
Alec Martinez
Jake Muzzin
We can do without Nolan and should trade Williams. Bernier will probably get moved too or would end up holding out to force a move IMO
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What about a buyout of Richards or Carter and then resigning them at a lower cap hit. It’s a possibility that would free up money. Voynov won’t get more than 2.5 a year. Mitchell goes. Williams and Penner go. Lewis stays, he is too important on the forecheck and on the pk.
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