30 Comments

1. KC23 says:

   February 14, 2013 at 4:24 pm

   Off topic: Kings are tied with Black Hawks for most Home games remaining (21).

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   DesertKing Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 4:36 pm

   @KC23,

   That could be the Conference race right there.

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   King Alex Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 4:37 pm

   @KC23, I’m not sure if this is a blessing or a curse as we seem to be a better road team. Only time will tell.

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   Deke'r Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 7:36 pm

   @King Alex, …that’s what I was thinking….

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2. Russ Dynda says:

   February 14, 2013 at 4:46 pm

   I’d like to put forward a hypothesis regarding the Dustin Penner situation and his lack of success here. I’m not privy to the state of his conditioning so I will not factor that into my theory.

   If we look at Penner’s past he had some successful seasons in Edmonton; that’s what made us seek his services. If we look at the numbers, in Penner’s best season anywhere he played 82 games, scored 32 goals and had 63 points. While doing so he only inflicted 55 hits! That means that he played several games that year without being credited with a hit. What this says to me is that in spite of his large physique, he’s a finesse player, not a physical, power forward type of guy. Sometimes large men play better using a small man’s style and vice versa. (Reminds me of the old NBA when the Houston Rockets had Ralph Sampson and Hakeem Olajuwon. Sampson was 5 inches taller but Olajuwon was the center because he played a center’s style while Sampson, at 7’4″ fit the forward position better.) If you watch Penner you will see he has soft hands and good passing skills as well as accuracy in his shot. But when he came here he was put into a situation where he was expected to use his size and I don’t think he was comfortable doing that. Last year he inflicted 90 hits in 65 games–exactly double the hit ratio of his best season–but only scored 7 goals.

   If I was Kings’ management I would recognize what this means and decide whether you can use his finesse skills or not. If we are so focused on our “power” game, especially on the 3rd and 4th lines, and expect everyone on those lines play that way, then I wouldn’t expect that much out of Penner and probably try to move him.

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   bbb7 Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 5:00 pm

   @Russ Dynda, You make a good point and perhaps Penner does need to be put on a more offensive line and be less pressured to be physical, but the stat that really stands out to me from his early years in Ana/Edm vs on the Kings is his shooting percentage in those earlier years was about 14% and with the Kings it’s been less than 6%. That tells me he doesnt work enough to get into prime areas to score with the Kings. We dont need him to be physical per se but we DO need him to go to the dirty areas more. A player who is closer to the skilled end of the ‘skilled-balanced-physical/aggressive’ spectrum just wont cut it with a 6% shooting percentage.

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   goldielocks Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 5:20 pm

   @Russ Dynda,

   I’ve been saying the same thing for a long time. Just because he is big, that doesn’t mean he need to park himself in front of the net and show his butt to the goalie all the time or be a wrecking ball to hit everybody on the ice. Ironically, Penner has the most sensitive hands and unique skating ability which most of oversized players don’t have. I’m not saying he’s a fast skater but the quick skater.

   He has been struggling in the Kings lineups because the system did not allow him to use his skills or should I say coaches were unable to find his spot in their system. But I didn’t mean that the system should be changed for him. No player has that kind of luxury. After all, this is the most physical sports of all.

   He’s been sidelined now and then because he made some bad defensive plays. Our system requires individual respnsibility in the defensive coverage. So he needs to adjust his game toward that area but at the same time he or coaches need to find the use of his skills in the system.

   I will watch closely how he adapts the system or how the system adapts his skills. But if they can’t find the way, he should move on to find the place where he can be the unique player and uilize his skills. I hate to lose him because I like the guy alot. But this is not the healthy situation for his professional career. I thought players like Carter and Richards benefit Penners talent, and still hoping that’s the case.

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   Russ Dynda Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 7:19 pm

   @goldielocks, Can’t argue with a thing you say. I’d like to see Penner get a chance to play with more skilled players. I think he could be an asset to us. But, if Sutter doesn’t intend to use him that way I think he should be moved, if possible.

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   kissmyblarneystones Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 7:37 pm

   @Russ Dynda,

   Don’t you think it’s strange that a player who is so capable says nothing when his coach calls him out. Could it be because the coach is right?

   On the face of it, it would appear Sutter has no respect for Penner. But then Maybe Penner is showing no respect for himself.

   He didn’t have to sign his contract at the end of last year if things were so bad for him here.

   

   Russ Dynda Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 8:25 pm

   @Russ Dynda, First of all, we don’t know what Penner is saying to Sutter away from the media. In addition to his possibly having more class than his coach, very few players are so stupid or so out-of-control that they are going to argue with their coach in the media. You’d likely get fined for that and maybe suspended.

   I didn’t bring up this topic here to criticize Sutter. As I said above, if he doesn’t feel he can use Penner’s skills he should recommend moving him on. That’s his privilege as coach. I don’t see the point in trying to turn a racehorse, in spite of his large size, into a Clysdale.

   While I am not happy with how Penner has been used, I don’t feel sorry for him. He did indeed, sign the new contract. Being a Kings’ fan, I just want to get the most out of him or have him replaced with someone who can help us more.

   And by the way, I responded to your previous message on the other blog.

   

   kissmyblarneystones Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 9:18 pm

   @Russ Dynda,

   It’s clear to me that you want to have your cake and eat it to.

   Penner has 2 rings, if anyone could afford to call out his coach, it’s him. Especially when he is in the last year of a contract he didn’t have to sign. If the situation is the way you see it, then I’d be tweeting from the hill tops if I was Penner. Because according to you, He isn’t being used correctly which in turn is diminishing his ice time. And if he can’t gets no ice time, he can’t make a case for getting signed to a deal worthy of the 2 rings he has. Your supposition with Penner makes no sense, because if I felt Sutter was doing that, I’d be screaming to anyone willing to listen. Yet Penner is silent. I wonder why? My opinion is that Penner isn’t saying squat to Sutter except “Yes Sir!” Let me ask you; When you go to work, do you dictate the terms of your employment to your boss?

   It all goes back to Penner taking responsibility for the contract he signed. He signed, being told what was expected of him. It was all over the blog that there were doubts about Penner resigning. He was in the doghouse during the season, but turned it on during the playoff. Who changed there? Penner or Sutter? I’ll tell you, it certainly wasn’t Sutter. If it was so bad for Penner, he could have looked elsewhere for employment. But he didn’t, and this is why your argument is flawed. Its flawed because you conveniently absolve Penner from any responsibility for his own actions and make Sutter responsible for them instead.

   Like you, I want the the Kings to get the most out of Penner, That’s why I want him to take the finger out and bust his ass. When he applies himself, he can be quite good at what he does. and I believe Sutter is coaching him in a way that makes him realize that.

   

   Russ Dynda Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 9:51 pm

   @Russ Dynda, I don’t have any problem with debating this but it seems as if you are looking to argue with me without recognizing the position I’m taking. I’m not attacking Sutter here. I think Terry Murray was doing the same thing with Penner. I think Penner has gotten himself labeled by the King’s organization and I think it’s unfortunate for the team in general.

   I don’t think either of us know what Penner is saying to Sutter, if anything, away from the media. You may be right, or maybe not. The point is, it would be self-destructive to try to complain in the media. It’s likely you would be benched, or fined, or suspended. Maybe you’d be screaming and then you’d likely pay the price. Or maybe Penner buys into what Sutter is saying. I’m not absolving Penner from any responsibility but it wasn’t him who has made the line assignments. All I started to say here is that I personally believe, based on past performance, that Penner would be better used in another role–finesse player on a scoring line. I don’t see Penner as lazy. I think he looks out of synch because he’s in the wrong role.

   

   kissmyblarneystones Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 10:08 pm

   @Russ Dynda,

   With me, It started when you asked the absurd question: “What was Darryl Sutter’s excuse for the teams poor performance”. I saw a comment of yours on Paul’s site (KND), which I responded to, and I felt it was totally disrespectful of a guy who came in here and helped me and a lot of other people realize a dream. I’m as contrarian as they come and you are clearly entitles to your opinion, but I have to say I took umbrage to you comments and attitudes towards Sutter.

   I may be wrong about the relationship between Penner and Sutter, But I don’t think so. I qualify that by saying that Penner had the option of leaving, but didn’t.

   

   Chip Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 10:56 pm

   @Russ Dynda,
   You are starting with the wrong premise. Players get credited with hits while defending. It doesn’t have anything to do with being a “power forward.” Penner just isn’t inclined to exert himself defensively. He can, but he just tends not to.

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   kissmyblarneystones Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 11:42 pm

   @Chip,

   Which pisses Sutter off. Thank You!

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   Russ Dynda Reply:
   February 15th, 2013 at 5:45 am

   @kissmyblarneystones, Hmmm, interesting. With all your “credentials” why did you just agree with Chip and not correct him regarding many hits being delivered on the forecheck, which is mainly an offensive strategy. I thought you passed Coaching 101. Maybe you need to retake the course.

   

   kissmyblarneystones Reply:
   February 15th, 2013 at 2:08 pm

   @Russ Dynda,

   My preferred area of expertise is attitude. Plenty can be overcome and done when you set your head right. Penner’s head hasn’t been right the last couple of years. But with Sutter’s help, he’s getting there.

   With regard to Coaching 101 and me retaking the course. I’m always interested in learning new things or viewing different perspectives. So, what have you got? Please explain it to me, I’m all eyes.

   

   Russ Dynda Reply:
   February 15th, 2013 at 4:17 pm

   @kissmyblarneystones, I’m in agreement with you that attitude is extremely important. I don’t know Dustin Penner personally–never met him or talked to him. Thus I don’t feel qualified to assess his attitude and to conclude that it is a major problem. I also don’t see Sutter helping him with an attitude, especially since I see a major attitude in Sutter himself.

   I don’t know you either and wouldn’t profess to know the extent of your coaching expertise. However, your views on Sutter’s coaching make me unimpressed with what you’ve referred as “credentials.” I’ve already explained why. And it was you who brought up Hockey 101. I don’t profess to know everything about coaching. But I recognize a coaching style and I see Sutter’s as very common and usually very unsuccessful over a period of time. Thus I fear he and Lombardi are going to tear down what has evolved here.

   

   Russ Dynda Reply:
   February 15th, 2013 at 5:41 am

   @Chip, Excuse me, but I think you are starting from the wrong premise. Many teams, including the Kings, use the forecheck, during which many hits are delivered, as an offensive tactic. Shoot the puck in, then pursue and batter the defense to get them to cough it up in their zone. Thus many credited hits take place in the offensive zone. It is this offensive approach that made us so successful in the Playoffs last year.

   I won’t try to defend Penner’s defensive effort. I don’t think he’s particularly skilled in that area. I don’t know if that’s due to lack of effort or just plain lack of ability. In any case, I don’t believe that’s not why we got him from Edmonton. We were looking for his offensive contribution. And I don’t believe he is that effective offensively when expected to focus on hitting during the forecheck. If we were looking for a 25 goal scorer who was also good on defense we should have been ready to give up more than Colton Teubert. Also, if Sutter feels that Penner is a defensive liability and can’t fit into the system then he should recommend Penner be moved.

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   kissmyblarneystones Reply:
   February 15th, 2013 at 2:16 pm

   @Russ Dynda,

   That’s why we got him, when TM was the coach. Guess what, he’s gone and a new Sheriff is in town, with a new plan. If Penner didn’t like it, he could have left……but he didn’t(hard to escape that, isn’t it. Both Penner and Sutter agreed on what was expected of him. I think you have forgotten what type of game Penner played during the playoffs. Might I suggest reviewing some tape?

   

   Russ Dynda Reply:
   February 15th, 2013 at 5:23 am

   @Russ Dynda, You may think it’s absurd to hold the coach responsible for the team’s performance, but I don’t. He was yapping with the media analyzing his players’ performance to them without taking any responsibility. If he can’t control their performance, we don’t need him. And if he can, then in front of the media he should be taking responsibility, WHICH HE HASN’T. That’s why I made the comments, I did and will like continue.

   I want more of my team than to be successful during a 20 game playoff run. I want to see success over a lengthy period–regular season, too. It’s not just about winning a Cup to me. I want to see great hockey consistently. Sometimes you can have a great team, have a great season, then run into another great team and not win the Cup. I will still feel good, knowing I saw great hockey all year. I remember the three lousy seasons we endured during Lombardi’s first three years, then watched us slip the nest three from 102 to 98 to 95 points, barely making it in last year. I was elated to win the Cup, but not that deluded to think we had a great season. We had a great 17 games. I was hoping that would extend into this season and we would prove ourselves to be a great team, although I was doubtful because I already saw cracks in the dike at the end of last regular season. The magical had happened, everything falling into place, most of it because of the players, not Sutter. He was making the same decisions as he’d made at the end of the regular season. And his prior history as a coach has been to have his team underachieve after rising to a brief pinnacle.

   I see a strong roster here with a stubborn, headstrong jockey starting to abuse it. If Sutter had kept his mouth shut to the media and not disrespected his players, he would deserve more respect. If your dreams are satisfied with winning one Cup after a rather mediocre season, enjoy it. I want more. I want a dynasty, and I want it during the regular season, too. I think we have the players to accomplish that. Let’s encourage them, not badmouth them all the time. Sometimes they need discipline. But if you keep whipping the horse, eventually he’ll become insensitized to it.

   And regarding Penner, let me say this once more. I agree that he could have left. I’m not trying here to make him a sympathetic figure. My point here is that I think the team has a chance to get more out of him if the coaching would recognize his talents and be more flexible with him. The way they are using him now they might as well move him.

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   kissmyblarneystones Reply:
   February 15th, 2013 at 2:47 pm

   @Russ Dynda,

   I can’t argue with anything you’ve said. I wan’t what you want, except that if I had to choose between the Presidents Cup and the Stanley Cup, I’ll take all the eighth seeds on offer.

   I want you to consider this view. Rightly or Wrongly. Coach Sutter is the same as all of us. He has his own stuff going on outside of hockey, and by all appearances, he’s pretty busy. So……

   Darryl get’s a call one day from a guy who he has worked with before,(a guy who actually fired him from his last coaching gig) and asked him if he would like to take on the Kings. From Darryl’s perspective, he see’s Kopi, Richie, Penner, Gags, Brown, Scud, Willie etc… and thinks to himself, ‘I’ve got a horse here’. So he drops tools in Canada(which personally and logistically was difficult to do at such short notice). Comes down here, and by experience and will, coaches our boys to a play-off spot. Simultaneous to that achievement, he has to change a system that was in place here a few years.

   I believe Sutter’s greatest success was getting the boys to believe what he already believed before taking the job. That we were good enough. By the time the Playoffs had rolled around, all the players had drank the kool-aid. So we do our thing during the Playoff and we all go home champs.

   I believe Sutter had a reasonable expectation that everyone would show up the next year ready to compete. But yet it appears no one did. He made a commitment, put his personal life on hold and came to work again ready to compete. Because his view is if you’re not going to be 100% committed there is no need to show-up.

   I think Sutter has a long view that was sold to him by this organization, and that is long term success. I said earlier that this year will show us just how good a coach Darryl Sutter actually is. I’ve seen nothing to alter that view yet.

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   Russ Dynda Reply:
   February 15th, 2013 at 4:38 pm

   @kissmyblarneystones, I think if I had to choose between them, I’d take the President’s Cup, although to win it and then fail to win the Stanley Cup would be very frustrating. The President’s Cup is an indication of success over a period four times as long as the Playoffs. And it’s also more of an indication of future success. That said, it’s just a matter of preference; you and I have different takes on sports competition.

   I’ve read and considered what you said and don’t see this the same way. First, by his own admission, he did not change the system here. He tweaked it, using Murray’s effective defensive system as it was but encouraging the team to make a greater commitment to go from defense to offense once they got possession of the puck. In my view, that freed the talented offensive players on this team, although our low goal scoring throughout the regular season indicated that this change had only marginal effect. I believe that under Murray the team felt in a straightjacket; he was completely unimaginative (seeing him behind the bench made me think of the Sphinx). So the players felt more relaxed last year under Sutter. And when things broke so well for us in the Playoffs, Sutter’s coaching wasn’t challenged and he had no reason to wield his overbearing attitude. Now it’s a different season and just like you I felt that this year would show us how good a coach we had. Unlike you, I don’t like what I see and I’m disgusted that Leiwicke has already inked him and DL to 4 yr extensions.

   In terms of the players showing up ready to compete. I personally have not seen evidence that the players have not been ready to compete. Some of them are not in as good shape as others. But, the circumstances surrounding the lockout played into that and most teams are having the same problem. So, as coach, you have to deal with that. I was disgusted at all the NHL players’ general attitude during the walkout. But once again, that’s behind us now and I do think they are committed to playing. I expect Sutter to quit complaining about the hand he’s been dealt (No camp, players’ out of shape, etc) and play the cards, just as the other coaches must.
3. BrokeKingsFan says:

   February 14, 2013 at 5:00 pm

   As much as I like Frasier (quite a bit actually) I think we need to keep Carter at center…If that means Frasier gets scratched every game then so be it. Carter was a monster last game in the center of the ice and a 1,2,3,4 combo punch of Kopi, Carts, Rick and Stolly is lethal IMO no matter who we play. Odds are at least 2 of the 4 will be going full speed on any given night and thats enough to keep this thing rolling…if 3 of the 4 or god willing all 4 are on thier game than that would be a wet dream for any Kings fan. Compound that with at least average D…repeat baby!

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   phil sykes Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 6:01 pm

   @BrokeKingsFan, could not agree more with you …. this guy knows what he is talking about

   (until he posts something i disagree with) ….. he he

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   Kings20 Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 7:51 pm

   @BrokeKingsFan, Would still bring Toffoli to the Richards line and move King or Nolan to the fourth. I think Toffoli will bring that spark that Richards need.

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   phil sykes Reply:
   February 14th, 2013 at 7:54 pm

   @Kings20, who knows …. but deano always moves at a snails pace . so probably not gonna happen

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4. linny says:

   February 14, 2013 at 9:46 pm

   It seems more often than not, that players’ offensive stats diminish greatly after coming to the kings? which is to b expected given our system (especially players from Edmonton like Penner n Stoll since they play an up-tempo offensive style there).Conversely, skill players (even borderline), seem to flourish elsewhere (Purcell, Moulson n Simmonds) for the same reason. As long as Pens can adapt he can b (n has proven he can IMO at times) he should stay n play. If that’s the main problem and he simply doesn’t like to play the way he needs to in our system, I think they should try to move him

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5. KC23 says:

   February 14, 2013 at 11:25 pm

   @King Alex, road hasn’t been that great so far this year. Then again, either has home.

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6. rogiesbackup says:

   February 14, 2013 at 11:54 pm

   Yes, I hope the DS keeps Pens in the line-up. His style of play which is BOTH finesse and power forward gives the King that diversity in the line-up. He seems to score many of his goals in the high slot, but I think his size “mentally” wears down the opponent.

   He was beast in the play-offs last season because he and the team had a purpose. Maybe, DS needs to keep him hungry to make him play with grit and determination.

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