Stuck around long after practice today to get a few words with Dean Lombardi, about the New York Yankees’ plans at the winter meetings. OK, actually, it was about the fact that the Kings are now ranked No. 30 in the NHL in goals per game and 5-on-5 goals. The team that made improved scoring a stated goal at the start of the season has instead had a fall-off, so here are Lombardi’s thoughts to a couple questions…
Question: When you look at the lack of scoring, I guess you can look at it on a micro or macro level. You can analyze individuals and say, “We need more from that guy, that guy and that guy,’’ or you can look at the big picture, whether it’s system, attitude, etc. How do you break down the problem?
LOMBARDI: “I do think it’s probably a combination of a number of things. Number one, no question, we set out to put a strong defensive structure in place, because there’s no doubt in my mind that it starts back there and it’s critical for the playoffs. That said, this year in particular, we made a point of saying that we don’t want to change our game, we want to add to our game. We don’t want to lose the foundation we put in place, but if we’re going to be a contender, it’s necessary that we add to the offensive side without losing our defensive part. After 27 games, we’re certainly not on a pace to get that done.
“Now, in terms of how we rectify this, first off, so many individuals are capable of more. We don’t have any players who should be on the down side (of their careers). We have a number of proven players with a track record in this league of putting up some numbers for offensive production. Whether it’s Willy [Justin Williams] or Gagne or Stoll, Penner, all of these guys have a proven track record and none of them are on the down side of their careers. Although I’m waiting for Selanne to get to the down side of his career, at 41, but that’s not happening. So there’s a band (of stats) there, that all these players should be able to be within, and all those guys should be able to expect that out of themselves again, without becoming sloppy defensively.
“With a number of our younger players, it’s about taking another step. They are still defining where they are going to be, in terms of the offensive side of the puck. I think a number of them have a lot of upside left, and it’s up to them to take that step, whether it’s Kopi or Jack or Doughty, Clifford, Voynov. All these kids have offensive potential that has yet to, I think, maximize. That’s just part of the development curve. So every individual has a responsibility to contribute more. It’s just that some of them have a proven track record, and some of them have to push themselves to be the best they can be.
“Secondly, I do think, when you say collectively, I would probably use the word `support.’ Again, I’m just talking offensively. I never want to lose sight of the fact that I don’t want to lose one iota defensively. In terms of supporting each other on the ice — this kind of goes to the question about the system, I do think it’s something we’ve talked to the coaches about a number of times — part of producing offense is being able to be there to support each other on the puck, getting open so that when someone has the puck, you’re open for him in a scoring position. Going to the net and creating space and rebounds is a fundamental part of support. When we’re in on the forecheck, that second man has to be closer and that third man has to be willing to jump. That is something that, no question, we have to improve on. Because when you’re establishing that, you’re establishing a tempo, particularly in your own building, that you’re going to play in the other team’s end. So if we’re supporting each other around the puck the right way, we’re going to play in the other team’s end more. Particularly at home, that’s going to get your crowd into it. Two, it’s actually going to make you better defensively, because you’re not defending.
“Thirdly, I think there’s an attitude. This malaise that has kind of seeped in here, given that we’re now 30th in the league, we’ve got to get beyond this whole thing and they have to believe in themselves the right way. So when Willy scores a goal, like the other night, we’ve got to get that attitude of, `Yeah, you’re freaking right,’ and not, `Whew, I scored.’ Here’s a veteran player that you’re counting on. As individuals, it’s human nature, don’t get me wrong, but we’ve got to get out of that funk, and have the attitude that we’re going to score. It’s not, `Oh my God, I scored.’ That goes for each individual, and it’s a team attitude. Because the same thing can happen to a team. You saw us the year we scored 236 goals. When we got down two goals, you never got the sense that this team didn’t think it could come back. But when you start falling into this rut mentally, it’s like, `Oh my God, we scored.’ We’ve got to get rid of that in a hurry. That’s attitude. So to answer your question, you’ve got individual issues, you do have system and support issues, and I think a big think is attitude. All three of them.’’
Question: If the fundamental system hasn’t changed — and Terry says, if anything, the system has been tweaked to be less defensive — that suggests the issue of attitude. Whose responsibility is that?
LOMBARDI: “You can have a system, and it doesn’t matter what sport you’re in. The Lakers can have their system, the Patriots can have their system, but you better have the right attitude. Part of attitude is believing in yourself the right way. I guess you can say it’s less restrictive, more aggressive. Whatever it is, it better come with the attitude to, or it’s just a diagram.’’
Question: But when you break it down, to find that attitude, does that fall on the coaches?
LOMBARDI: “It’s both. The coaches have a responsibility and the players have a responsibility. And we do too, upstairs. It’s the entire organization. We’ve all got responsibility. In the line of fire, though, they’re the ones down there in the trenches, and coaches and players have to find that.’’
random topic: i was at Ponda center and Penner played pretty well. i wanted to know if it was just me that thought that or if anyone disagreed. But i see him picking it up.
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tomb Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 3:52 pm
@FRO, I agree. Putting him with Kopitar and Brown will pay dividends in the long run.
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mash-ola Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 3:52 pm
@FRO, No, he looked very good last night. He’s skating hard and his skill is much more apparent as his confidence level seems to have been somewhat restored. Now would be an excellent time to re-insert him with Kopitar and Brown to see if that sparks that line back into it’s scoring potential.
GO KINGS GO
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Harty Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:01 pm
@mash-ola, he has to keep it up
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puckbob Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:46 pm
@Harty, that’s right, he looked good last nite but 1 game don’t prove much. just that he CAN play if he wants to
Lake Forest Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 3:53 pm
@FRO, Everyone agrees. Best game yesterday by far since being a king. Looking for him to pick it up.
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CB14 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 3:54 pm
@FRO, I was at the game with puck73 and jess, and we all thought the same thing. He had life in his legs for the first time as a King. He also looked good in the previous game too.
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Harty Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:02 pm
@CB14, he did have better skating legs, no question
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brian spain Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 10:46 pm
@CB14, Penner has some mad skills, he looked like a little kid having fun out there. I hope he stays healthy and keeps playing the same way. He CAN BE a stud.
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TJM Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:42 pm
@FRO, He’s been better every game since Ritchie went out. I also think the last couple games before Penner himself went out were much better as far as offensive movement and prresence.
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TJM Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:42 pm
@TJM, [sp]
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MM Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:18 pm
@FRO, To me, that’s 2 games in a row that Penner has played solidly. I used to scream at the TV when I would see Penner skating in small circles while everyone else zoomed around him for the 30 seconds he was out on the ice.
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USHA#17 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:22 pm
@FRO,
As perhaps the #1 Penner detractor last season and early this season count me as standing up and saying that Penner, starting with the game prior to the hand injury, has been improving markedly with each passing game…to the point where I felt he was one the top players in each of the past two games.
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Bob Bobson Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 9:22 pm
@FRO, Agreed, lots of the Kings fans around me kept hassling him but I thought he has actually played well the past couple games.
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EJ Reply:
December 8th, 2011 at 5:29 am
@FRO, yes, his game was much better, but that said, he still had a couple of glaring turnovers.
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Perro Reply:
December 8th, 2011 at 7:42 am
@FRO, loved his net pressence. Big body planted right in front of the net, that’s where he needs to be.
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PRMan Reply:
December 8th, 2011 at 12:32 pm
@FRO, Penner outskated everyone else on the Kings. That’s sad, but props to him for bringing it.
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Thanks for the interview Rich. Nothing out of the ordinary from DL. Same old, same old.
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Jason4Kings Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:03 pm
@CB14,
You’re freaking right i scored!
That should be the billboard off the 5 freeway next season, with a big picture of MR.
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CB14 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:15 pm
@Jason4Kings, I like it!
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MM Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:21 pm
@Jason4Kings, I am willing to chip in $20 for this billboard to me made so long as the pic of MR is of him taking a shot from one knee like a boss!
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taz42 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:52 pm
@CB14, In fact, he used a lot of words (as usual) to in otherwords say, the whole team is stinking it up.
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USHA#17 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:24 pm
@taz42,
Same old, same old. More like old same, old same. You team has a mental problem DL…and I think you know whats underlying this malaise.
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Newf Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:24 pm
@taz42, when DL explains something in a sentence or two…then i’d worry.
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Thank you Rich!
“So to answer your question, you’ve got individual issues, you do have system and support issues, and I think a big think is attitude. All three of them.”
So the GM feels the players need to suck it up and start listening to some leadership in the room? That was my take! Also seems as if some of this is still growing pains; still finding the ceiling of potential and stuff, veterans needing to relax and do what got them there, and some damn attitude adjustments!! Finish your checks Kings!!!
I feel better already after listening to DL. He’s calm, why shouldn’t I be? Let’s win a game on Thursday!
GKG
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neil Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 3:56 pm
@Stuart, To me it seemed that at the end he put the blame on the players and the coach….and you know the saying…you cant fire the players…..
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mash-ola Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 3:56 pm
@Stuart, There’s no reason to be in panic mode yet. They’re still within striking-distance of the conference lead, and there is a lot of parity in the league this season,so no one is going to pull away from anyone. The Sharks, Stars and Ducks are also struggling.
It’s frustrating as hell, true. But there is still a lot of time for things to happen. It’s more about how the team is playing in the spring than it is now.
Patience is a virtue, eh?
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Stuart Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:01 pm
@mash-ola, possessed by few, practiced by fewer…or something like that!
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luc20rules Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:48 pm
@mash-ola, I think we can win the division, but with the other divisions having a couple of soft teams I think 3rd seed is the best that can be achieved this year with the team we have.
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Forum67 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:29 pm
@Stuart,
What I glean from the interview from DL is that people like me need to accept the fact that TM’s job is still safe. Whether that will continue to be true remains to be seen. I’ll stand by my belief is that the only sure way that TM is sure to be fired is if the Kings miss the playoffs.
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Since '67 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:27 pm
@Forum67, Unfortunately that is a real possibility.
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scepin Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:37 pm
@Forum67, No!!!!!!!!!!!! We need to lose the next 10 games if we want to succeed. Lose 10 more in a row and Murray is gone. Murray gone means a new coach and a new, probably realistic systme. Then we’ll make the playoffs and begin to get somewhere.
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mash-ola Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 7:23 pm
@scepin, team tanking just to get the coach fired, eh? That’s just plain ridiculous. And if that’s the case, and I’m quite certain it’s not, then be careful what you wish for, because I’m sure some players would be moved out as well.
mash-ola Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 7:22 pm
@Forum67, I’ve had that attitude since the pre-season. Give him this year. If the Kings don’t make the playoffs, or if they can’t make it past the first round, then that is my marker that a change behind the bench needs to be made. Not now. I’m not a huge fan of his, but I personally don’t see how firing him now will do any good. Again, my opinion. The players on the ice need to step up as well as the coaching/management.
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Southbay Phil Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 9:35 pm
@mash-ola, I’ve been a season ticket holder for many years and, sadly, I must admit that I have been secretly (until now) rooting for the Kings to lose so we can move beyond the TM era. The goal scoring problem is not new and I have grown tired of all the pat excuses from all concerned. It’s time for change. Let’s not wait and waste another year off the contracts of our core players. Let’s fix it now.
Attitude starts at the top. It’s time to shelve our expectations for this season and begin seriously looking at bringing a coach in who can bring us to the next level.
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Daniel Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:30 pm
@Munchrat, That can be done right now though. I don’t get why DL is letting this ship sink before making a move to get the most out of our solid roster. Both of them will be gone if this keeps up.
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USHA#17 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:25 pm
@Daniel,
Worse, come trade deadline we won’t be able to attract any talent.
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xeropoint Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:32 pm
@USHA#17, Hell, even when things were trending UP, we haven’t bagged any notable FA’s. Most every good move has been through trade.
Choralone Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 11:01 pm
@xeropoint, Handzus, Scuderi, and Mitchell were all FA signings. You’re never really going to get “core” players through free agency. Those three were good pickups – we just had to overpay to get them.
mash-ola Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 7:27 pm
@Munchrat, Like who? I still can’t think of any real legitimate possibilities here. Making a change just to make a change isn’t always the answer. You want a boring, match-up coach? Carlyle is your man. But I’m not sold on him. Bob Hartley? Paul Maurice? Not much out there, and no way in hell will the Kings hire Barry Melrose or Ted Nolan. They won’t bring in a newbie coach either or a coach from the college or junior hockey ranks. That would be step backwards in my opinion.
So who, then???
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Its DL’s fault if…..Moreau,Hunter,Lewis,Cliffy,Richardson,Lotki…ETC just are plain bad players and couldnt score under any coach.
Its TM’s fault if Moreau,Hunter,Lewis,Stoll,Cliffy,Richardson,Penner,Lotki, ETC are decent scorers under a different coach.
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Dave Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:19 pm
@neil, don’t forget Williams, Gagne, Penner and the rest of the team.
they score everywhere else – just not here.
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wade chernick Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:00 pm
@neil, How did we allow Matt Moulson to leave? Why couldn’t he make it in L.A.?
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poorplight Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 10:03 pm
Don’t forget about Teddy Purcell either.
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Pesus Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 6:14 pm
@neil,
He said these guys arent scoring, no crap! Why arent they scoring? Thats what he needs to answer.
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Paul G Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 6:20 pm
@neil, Cliffy and Lokti? Seriously? I’m glad DL is our GM and not someone else….
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You need to fire your coach. End of story. The Kings are 30th in the NHL on offense and are barely clinging to a playoff spot with San Jose having three games in hand, 1 point behind us. We are consistently in the bottom 5 of the league on offense with Murray, with the exception of Doughty’s Norris nominated season. It needs to stop. Just the fact that we are in playoff contention is a testament to our talent, especially on defense, but we really need someone who can utilize that talent better. We have the oldest coach in the league, and it shows. We are running systems that are 20 years old and are unsuccessful in today’s NHL. Make the call Lombardi. 30th in the NHL is unacceptable with this roster.
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fsd1 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 3:57 pm
@Telos, i disagree! hail TM hail Murray!
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370455vinSD Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:14 pm
@fsd1, Let’s hope it doesn’t come down to a hail Murray.
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Helvetica Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:25 pm
@370455vinSD, Kopitar has been pretty good with those…
LAK1ngs Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:49 pm
@fsd1, If by hail, you mean pummel him with ice I’m all in.
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Pesus Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 6:18 pm
@LAK1ngs,
Bullets?
ziggyfan Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:18 pm
@Telos, agreed and agreed. Let TM go.
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Bringbackbutchgoring Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:21 pm
@Telos, So negative. Try to put a more positive spin on things. I mean, after all, we are one of the surprise teams this year so far
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Daniel Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:31 pm
@Bringbackbutchgoring, Surprisingly average…The time is now? Hardly.
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Helvetica Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:32 pm
@Bringbackbutchgoring, The only surprise is that were playing THIS poorly.
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Bill M. Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:47 pm
@Bringbackbutchgoring, You mean, as in “SURPRISE! WE’RE ONLY MEDIOCRE!”???
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bringbackbutchgoring Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:06 pm
@Bill M., Exactly, we are the talk of the league
Kevco Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 7:28 pm
@Bringbackbutchgoring, Surprise that we are 30th in the leugae in scoring 5 on 5 with the addition s we made?
[Reply]
zulov Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 6:21 pm
@Telos, We had a better offensive team that year – Zeus was scoring, Frolov put up 19 Goals and 51 points. Smyth. Simmonds was scoring. Other teams were expecting less from us. I remember when the Kings spanked the Cunucks 8-3. Frolov had one or 2, Brownie had 2. Scoring 8 goals in one game for this team is like asking for snow in Los Angeles.
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Paul G Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 6:22 pm
@Telos, I don’t think DL is accepting the fact that HE might be dismissed if the Kings have an early playoff exit due to his hesitation of firing Murray
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poorplight Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 10:04 pm
@Telos, I wonder if we could pry Brent Sutter out of Calgary.
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I predict over 500 posts on this story!!!!!!
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fsd1 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 3:58 pm
@neil, especially if telos posts anymore!
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Rich, nice how you politely summed up all the banter around here into three solid questions.
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Goon Squad Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:09 pm
@Jason4Kings, agree… good on Rich for being as direct as possible within the boundaries of tact.
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pautna Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:02 pm
@Jason4Kings, Agreed.
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@Telos, You can say that again, and again.
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@Telos, it’s like deja vu all over again…
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special note…Thanks to Rich for attacking the issues with DL… also thanks to DL for answering!!!!!
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BTW was Moreau and Hunter really on the second line today during practice????
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@Telos, now that’s a threepeat. One more post than goals scored by the Kings per game on average.
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DL is correct, its a collective problem and a mental block with players right now, they need to go out like its pond hockey inside the oppositions blueline and tight as a drum inside our blueline……
Turn this ship around now boys, stop you have the talent and toughness more so then anyother team…..
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@Telos, did you really feel the need to post that 3 times?! Why is everyone so negative on here?! It’s getting really old! Fox said the other night that everyone in tbe NHL pretty much uses the same system. So it’s not going to change. It’s the players on the ice. They can do it, we’ve seen it. They just need to dig deep to get it done. There’s plenty of time left in the season. Why are you even talking about what place we’re in as far as playoffs go?! It’s silly…
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Forum67 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:39 pm
@Laura,
So following the logic that everyone pretty much uses the same system then why fire any coach, ever? As to the negativity on the scoring issue, this isn’t new and it hasn’t been an issue just this season.
And I can’t speak for anyone but myself, but I really bought into the Kings ad campaign, “The Time is Now”. Or at least I bought into it at the beginning of the season. And I’d like to buy into it again. But I know that isn’t going to happen as long as we continue to be bottom feeders in terms of scoring.
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Overall, I like what DL has done for this organization. Honestly though, he really can’t just sit back on this one this time, and hope it all just works itself out. Scoring has been an issue for too long now. DL made more than enough moves over the last couple years to provide TM with a good enough roster to at least be in the top ten in scoring. At this point, Terry Murray is just starting to make DL look bad. It’s either DL’s roster isn’t nearly that good, or his coach isn’t really that good. Either way, it makes him start to look bad if he doesn’t make a move soon.
Personally, I think it has to start with the coaching staff. DL obviously chose the players he did because he believed in them, and the only way to tell if he was right about his players, is to see if another coach can get more of what is expected out of them. Only then will you be able to tell if more roster moves need to be made.
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xeropoint Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:25 pm
@PP Anybody?, Concur. Especially if they are pitching “The time is now” how could he sit back and hope things work themselves out? It’s time for less philosophy and more results.
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Jason4Kings Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:28 pm
@xeropoint, Yes yes! Less process, more points.
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StillKingly Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 7:22 pm
@PP Anybody?, I concur great points
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“When we got down two goals, you never got the sense that this team didn’t think it could come back.”
Man. I wrote a post this morning that covers the EXACT TOPIC
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wavesinair Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:11 pm
sorry, messed up…see below.
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Great. We have an attitude issue and a coach who doesn’t believe its his responsibility to motivate players.
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Weasel Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:09 pm
@King Taco,
Whoa, I went back and re-read the story, where does it say the coach doesn’t think it’s his job to motivate? Or was that from an earlier story?
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King Taco Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:13 pm
@Weasel, This is going back a few weeks to a Murray interview.
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Weasel Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:17 pm
@King Taco,
Hmm, hope he meant in a better way than simply “I don’t motivate”. As in the player better damn well be motivated themselves or else.
King Taco Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:29 pm
@Weasel,
I think that’s exactly what he meant minus the “damn well” and “or else.”
Gary Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:11 pm
@King Taco, You just have players that have tuned there coach out. Fire the coach and the attitude changes.
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Weasel Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:19 pm
@Gary,
Not sure they have tuned him out yet. When they tuned out AM it was really obvious. And, yes, when that happens you have to change the coach. And sooner or later almost all teams need coaching changes for this very reason (no better example than baseball’s Billy Martin). But, we’ll start to hear things pretty soon if the team has quit on TM.
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LVKINGS88 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:01 pm
@King Taco, Hey King Taco do you work for Tacomakingsfan?,LOL
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King Taco Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:09 pm
@LVKINGS88, Haha. I see what you did there. But I must ask, who are the L Vikings?
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LVKINGS88 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 7:39 pm
@King Taco, LOL.
tacomakingsfan Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:56 pm
@LVKINGS88,
We are of not relation…. Stupid is stupid does… Lol
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Love DL’s response. There is a veiled “fire TM” in there or not so veiled. So, the expectation is clearly laid out. Score more, walk the walk, never quit or else.
I’m sure the players understand what’s at stake too. So, we’ll see if they respond. If they can’t respond in a reasonable amount of time (by DLs standards) I assume we’ll see a change in the coaching staff.
Also, on the Penner off topic post by “Fro” – yeah Penner looked good on TV. He wants to pass, he doesn’t want to hit and he may be a bit too big and not an agile enough skater to be a hitter. On the other hand he does try. Even when he blows a pass you can see what he was thinking, perhaps he defers too much and needs to be more selfish to be more productive. (Just imo of course)
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DBking Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:48 pm
@Weasel, never quit or else what? The one thing we haven’t seen from DL is that killer instinct. We have never seen anyone be held accountable for…umm.. anything!
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“When we got down two goals, you never got the sense that this team didn’t think it could come back.”
Man. I wrote a post this morning that covers the EXACT TOPIC and how it’s related to attitude… or as I put it, fortitude.
————————————————————–
SHOCK: There’s nothing wrong with the Kings lack of scoring
I got to thinking (uh oh).
What if the Kings problem has nothing to do with a lack of scoring? What if it has everything to do with a lack of fortitude? What if the Kings, under the weight of expectation, can’t handle the truth?
And the truth is, this team buckles under adversity. I’ll leave the why to others, but here’s the how…
Continue reading here »
What do you think?
[Reply]
Weasel Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:15 pm
@wavesinair,
Troubling trait so far. But no way to truly judge yet. It’s been all one step forward two steps back and vice versa. It still feels like the team has not found its identity at all. Maybe the new guys are still trying to figure out “who” to be?
Maybe the DD contract squabble disrupted the chemistry a bit. Maybe the other teams have spotted something that we haven’t adjusted to yet (We do seem to have trouble when other teams cycle in our zone).
Maybe TM isn’t the right guy. Or maybe it’s just one of those need to fire the coach because you can’t fire the players situations.
Maybe it’s starting in Europe always seems to cause a hangover.
And maybe the team just isn’t as good as everyone wants to believe.
But, it’s not panic time yet. It’s time to be concerned yes. It’s time to keep all options in mind and be prepared to act if need be, definitely. But, no panic.
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CB14 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:35 pm
@wavesinair, The players have no confidence in the system they are playing, that’s why they have no hope of coming back after getting down a goal or two.
I forget after which game it was, but earlier this year JJ said something to the affect of “We know with the system we play we’re not going to score too many goals”. So when he says something like that you understand how they get in that mindset once they are trailing.
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Jason4Kings Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:43 pm
@CB14,
“THE SYSTEM” is starting to sound like an esoteric religion to me.
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wavesinair Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:08 pm
@Jason4Kings,
Already taken! The System by Tony Robbins.
LVKINGS88 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:08 pm
@Jason4Kings, Repeat after me in a monotone voice, “THE SYSTEM,THE SYSTEM,THE SYSTEM,THE SYS………….etc……….
xeropoint Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:38 pm
@wavesinair, Some cold, hard numbers there. I can’t say I’ve seen a whole lot of Wild games this year but I have seen plenty of others. I smell what you’re cookin’ here but at the same time, I get the sense that it’s more than just the Wilds’ ability to score timely goals or believe in themselves more than the Kings do. The offensive numbers are close, but what about scoring chances? Unfortunately these are not recorded officially.
I would be willing to bet that Minnesota would be near the top of the league in scoring chances and that the Kings would be near the bottom. That would account for the disparity in talent between these two rosters, imo.
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wavesinair Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:11 pm
@xeropoint,
Yest we beat them decisively.
Sure, it’s just a theory. But regardless, something has to account for being so close offensively and yet worlds apart in the standings.
Maybe it’s just luck. Maybe it’s leadership. Maybe it’s the coach. But the bottom line is the Kings can’t fight their way out of a paper bag right now.
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Socalr6 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 8:50 pm
@wavesinair, Excellent comment and breakdown on neutral zone play by Cynic.
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the real question here hasn’t been answered yet – can the Kings play a more offensive game under TM? even if TM says he wants more forecheck, more offense, etc., will this team actually respond to him? and on top of that, TM continues to dress folks that have very little chance of scoring (Moreau, Westgarth) and continues to sit more talented offensive players (Richardson, Lewis).
saying you want to free the guys up to be more attacking is one thing, acting on it and getting the players to believe you is quite another.
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Brig33 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:22 pm
@Dave, Exactly the point. If TM continues to punish players who are offensive minded no one on the team is going to want to play that way. They are getting mixed signals IMO. I think they need a clear message, score have energy and battle you get to play, if you don’t you sit no matter who you are. I just hope the players aren’t afraid to be more aggressive offensively because they’re afraid of being out of position or sacrificing defense. Remember safe is death, it’s especially true in today’s NHL.
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ziggyfan Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:24 pm
@Dave, TM thinks so called “veteran players” are better than the young trying hard player. The problem is, these veteran players are has beens and can’t contribute anymore or, just ain’t got it in Westgarth’s case. Just because he scored one goal doesn’t mean he will again soon.
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joan fondell Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:01 pm
@Dave, I agree. Richardson and Lewis should be in the line-up. They are faster and have more offensive punch and ability. Although Westy had a good couple of games, (and a goal), he’s not going to give you scoring upside. The kings play well, when they are at top speed, they back off the D, they are uptempo and are fun to watch. They play with passion. The last two games, the Kings played like they had 50 pound weights attached to their skates–lethargic and slow. Penner is a slow player– yes he had a good game–Mazel tov! At $4mil he should. No one is talking about Doughty–where’s our $7mil man?
I like what I read about DL’s comments–why is Doughty finding himself? He thinks he’s worth $7mil-he has a high opinion of himself–show it to us! Voynov is finding himself. Cliffy is finding himself. Jack Johnson has skills. The bottom line, is that Moreau and Hunter are better defensively, but off no scoring upside to speak of. I’d rather have Lewis and Richardson in the lineup. Furthermore, Moreau and Hunter and Westy tend to take penalties and end up in the penalty box.
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So we have issues?
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tornado12 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:47 pm
@408kingsfan, issues? what issues? what does that mean? are you talking to me?
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408kingsfan Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:30 pm
@tornado12, Ok everyone! I am going to be the bigger man here and come out publicly to say I have been wrong about Dustin Penner all along. He is awesome,talented, and an instrumental part of the Kings success. I am sorry to everyone on this blog who have had to endure my Penner bashing ways.
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tornado12 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:39 pm
@408kingsfan, congratulations on your first step to recovery…the first step is admitting you are powerless to your addiction of pennerholism…next is believing that a POWER (DL) can restore you to sanity…
Goal! That’s right baby!
Not
“Holy crap that actually went in!
He’s saying that the more the players doubt the system the more malaise it will become. I cannot argue that at all. Very good point. ‘Accept the system and things will be the best they can be.’
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The Kings just need a new system. That’s it.
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fsd1 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:40 pm
@King Sachmo Stallion Maximus The Great, and you tell us the same thing every post….yawn
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C mon that interview was like a lot of my post… Long and boring. This is what I heard. Attitude!!
Like I,ve been saying it comes down to the Vets. These guys know how to put up numbers. I’m sure not one of them has an excuse for their bad play. Only way to change things is being accoutable. This team is going to win their next two games. Things will get rolling again. I’m sure them guys in the locker room don’t like being 30th in the league at scoring. Opposeing players are going to rib them hard till they get out of the basement. Can’t wait till our next game. I feel sorry for the Wild. Their going to get a pissed off Kings team. Look for the Kings to win in a big way. Love it or hate this is what it’s like being a Kings fan.
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Weasel Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:22 pm
@kinginsaltlake,
The wild are amazing right now. They keep getting come from behind victories. Of course, relying on that tactic usually doesn’t payoff in the long term.
If and i mean IF as in IF IF IF IF IF IF the Kings had pulled out the win last night it could have beena real turning point in the season. It just had that feel. Swarming and moving and then plink off DD’s stick and up over and in……….stunned silence of the “w t f just happened nature”
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OK, is it just me, or did I read a whole lot of fluff and absolutely no substance? Translation- I have full faith in the coaching staff and we are going to keep plugging along, crossing our fingers and praying everyone breaks out of this funk at the same time. I’ll get on my knees tonight and say a big prayer for the team to turn it around. If it works for baseball players…why not?
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wavesinair Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:28 pm
@wideleft,
There was a lot of double talk. Saying it starts and the top then quickly back peddling saying it’s on the players….and coaches. Nice. Can’t be both DL! If it STARTS at the top, it starts with YOU.
So maybe the “attitude” hasn’t been built correctly. It’s no wonder everyone thinks Richards is our best player. The guy comes from attitude city to LA. I think this does start at the top and I’m beginning to believe it’s a leadership issue and nothing to do with the offense.
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wideleft Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:35 pm
@wavesinair, Good take! I ‘m just hoping Richards isn’t thinking OMG have how many years on this contract? I sure saw that face on Kopi, not only in the pre-game warmup but also right after that winning goal was scored. Both were a picture of dejection & frustration. I said it in another post, if we don’t get to at least the 3 round by the time Kopi’s contract is up, I truly feel he will bolt.
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PP Anybody? Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:15 pm
@wavesinair, Personally, I think the “attitude” can be completely contributed to the lack of an offensive minded system. This system is purely passive in nature. The whole system is predicated on not putting oneself out of position, not taking chances, and waiting for the other team to make a mistake. I think it’s hard to foster any sort of aggressive “attitude” within that mindset. I think this is why we don’t see the Kings dictating play most of the time, and why they don’t get any first period goals in particular. Sure, I think Richards probably has more of a tenacious personality than any other current King, but I don’t think that everyone on this team is necessarily soft either. I just think that this whole system is bringing them down, and I don’t think it’s just X’s and O’s(although I think some actual schemes and tactics should definitely be changed also).
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xeropoint Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:28 pm
@PP Anybody?, THIS. The problems routinely persist and are only compounded when the team is slumping.
King Sachmo Stallion Maximus The Great Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:29 pm
@wideleft, Save us Jebus!
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Helvetica Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:30 pm
@wideleft, You missed the part where he basically laid all blame on the players for not believing in themselves and not having the right attitude. Lombardi believes the team has been assembled properly. He believes the coach and the system are correct. Unfortunately, he believes the players have not yet developed the right attitude to score and win games.
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Jason4Kings Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:34 pm
@Helvetica, ….. and Justin Williams is not supposed to go, “Whew! I scored.”
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wideleft Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:46 pm
@Helvetica, And if that’s what DL’s intent was…then I say B.S. because they certainly had the right attitute last year with less talent. They brought in 2 top line scorers and several veterans for “that” leadership roll. My interpretation is that DL did not assemble this team properly, with the exception of a couple. He blames it on youth, and they need to take that next step. Again, that wasn’t an issue last year, the youth did step up. I’ve finally come to the conclusion (like many others here) is that TM did a great job with bringing up the youth and mentoring them.I feel he is not capable of bring this team to the next level and the Veterans have basically tuned him out.
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Helvetica Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 7:19 pm
@wideleft, I have to say, and i think everyone would agree, the Kings do look pretty good… on paper. If i am to accept that it s a matter of the player sdeveloping the right attitude and maturity, then i dont think we can expect them to just turn things around so quickly and the whole, “The Time is now” campaign sort of rings hollow.
Personally, although i have harped on it, i dont think the system is really the cause of the problems. I also think we have the talent (on paper) to be a very successful team. If i’m being honest, i agree with (mostly) DL’s assessment. In which case, all we can do is hang on for the ride as we watch the team develop it’s identity… as painful as that may end up being this year. If i’m pointing the finger at anybody, it’s at our captains for not being more like Mike Richards. At our coach for not feeling the need to motivate our players. And possibly DL for not recognizing a way to fix the attitude problem in some way.
So basically, this team doesn’t believe in itself and it shows. Because, it’s not the system. It’s not the coach. It’s the players. Good to know we have a bunch of players that are just excited when they score a goal.
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Unfortunately, I don’t see the team breaking out of any malaise without a catalyst. We’ve passed the point of no return on that. Why, you ask? I don’t see any attitude in this team whatsoever. They look tired and lazy and generally bored. Trade a “core” player for something significant in return, or bring in a new coaching staff. This team needs a wake up call, and no amount of “believe in yourself” speeches or “dot to board” diagrams will change that.
By the way, NHLN had us listed as a top three disappointment this season, alongside Montreal and Tampa Bay.
Hope you saw that, Deano. You hold all the control here. Do something with it, or go down with your sinking ship.
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Being a kings fan sucks. We allowed ourselves to get suckered in to thinking “this year will be different”. Well, it’s not. I just hope they win a few home games against teams that have obnoxious visiting fans. It would be nice to rub it in the face of Canuck, Red Wing, B-Hawk fans for once.
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Thank You for asking that question Rich.
That was also probably the nicest way to ask it.
Great job.
Again.
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LAK1ngs Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:03 pm
@Matt George, Seconded.
It’s been the hot topic, and you asked it in the nicest way possible.
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For a defense first system, our defense is really not that great. We are still allowing a lot of shots on goal and are paying top dollar for defensive players.
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It is so easy to blame the coach. The PLAYERS are the ones that need to execute on the ice!! Doughty has been one of our WORST defensemen, Penner as good as he has played lately is still a HUGE disappointment, Lokti has been marginal at best, Clifford until recently has looked lost etc etc. If our system and coach are so bad why has Kopi and Richards looked like All Stars? They play against the other team’s BEST line shift after shift but are still putting up points. I say the players need to EARN their way on this team!! Stop blaming TM, Dean or Kompon for the players lack of scoring and blame the players. Look at the Packers, they KNOW they are going to come back and put up points needed to win the game and they go out and get it done, the Kings need a confidence booster to remind them of what they COULD be not how bad they are playing. I bet $500 dollars with a friend that the Kings will win the Cup before the Wings do and more importantly than the money, there is no way in hell I want to get laughed at while handing over 5 Ben Franklins!! GO KINGS GO!!
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flex Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 7:02 pm
@Play2Win, Lisen man,we have this scoring problem for 36 months ALREADy. TM himself knows and said several times that we need improvment..we nee we need ..The same thing over and over…but this getting worse!!!Today we are the worse team in NHL.Sure ,some players will have down time…but again this OLD PROBLEM..and it is clear for everybody that TM got no idea what to do.Even DL recognize that this is (ALSO) coaches problem.This is the best line up we ever got and…
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I think Lombardi is holding back. This is definitely a coaching issue, look at Ponikorovski and Smyth and Simmonds and any other player who has gone from playing under Terry Murray to just about any other team and they are playing much better much stronger rolls. These players were never bad at all in LA but the coaching style has changed their game in a very positive way. Poni has i believe more than double the goals he had last season with the kings and its only a third of the way through the season. Good year? maybe, In conjunction with a much better coach who knows where to put these players and lets them play the game that they became professionals at. They stood out in their way, Let them incorparate that into the “system” stop telling us “shot mentality” “move the legs” “net presence” we all learned that in high school too. Bring out some raw talent.
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Harry Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:46 pm
@Neil,
2 very good examples:
Matt Moulson
Teddy Purcell
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neil Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 6:17 pm
@Neil, hey Iam Neil…the original TM basher..A troll.A geek….Neil from the Daily News days!!!! BTW my take was if the coach didnt change the attitude of the players more then the system itself…TM would be gone….
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Kingsfansouth Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 7:37 pm
@Neil, Poni plays a different system with the Canes. Much more wide open. Trust me. I attend the games. Poni will double hispoint total from last year. It is the coaching and the system. Needs immediate attention before we sink. Pls DL pull TM. We have a great AHL coach here in Charlotte that is both a leader and motivator. Look his name up. Great young and rising coach. PK, I’m done. Hoping for dreams of coaching changes while I sleep. GKG
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Basically Rich I have no god damn clue Dean said as he was watching another episode of CLUELESS. Fire this moron before its too late. Robitaille could be the GM and Granato the coach or bring in Gretzky. Anyone but these 2 idiots that haven’t gotten the clue the team has quit and the fans are about too. Wait until the Lakers start and no one gives a damn about hockey.
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Jason4Kings Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 4:49 pm
@Dan, Basketball sucks, Lakers can start anytime, don’t care either way. This is a hockey site.
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@wavesinair, nice article, well written.
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Yadda,Yadda,Yadda,blaah,blaaah that’s the only thing that every comes out of this guys mouth!
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Bkrs-Bud Reply:
December 8th, 2011 at 8:45 am
@David, Boo hoo is the only thing you and others on here seem to type everyday.
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so no question about how many games he’ll let the kings sit as the lowest scoring team in the league before he fires Murray? Come on Rich.
No question of, “as is, does this team look like a playoff team?”
Mike Richards & Willie Mitchell better get healthy quick…Terry Murray’s job depends on it.
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Rich Hammond Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:01 pm
Yes, those questions would have elicited honest, thoughtful, definitive answers. Can’t believe I didn’t think of them,
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Lanny McDonald's 'Stache Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:34 pm
@Rich Hammond,
HAHA… classic. Just posting to let you know that you’re really finding your groove in terms of phrasing your questions tactfully while still driving to the heart of the matter. Keep it up bud!
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neil Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 6:18 pm
@Rich Hammond, just when you think Rich is reading our comments..He comes out !!!!!
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neil Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 6:19 pm
@neil, that shouldve said..”isnt reading”
Kingsfanone Reply:
December 8th, 2011 at 5:00 am
@neil,
I think Rich is always reading our comments. Just ask those who are on moderation.
Murray needs to go. He had his chance. He was given a solid team on paper, but he cannot get these guys to score. It is obvious that it is style and tactics that has to change on the ice. It is this year or never for the Kings, as the new league alignment keeps them out of the playoffs for a long time to come, if Murray is in command. At this stage, there is nothing to lose by canning Murray, as the team is just not entertaining and interesting to watch with anemic scoring. This is a continuation from last year and the year before, and so it has to stop now.
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If we fire TM, what coaches are available that would be good replacement?
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joan fondell Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:04 pm
@King4life, Exactly. WIsh we could get Bylsma! Loved him as a player.
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tornado12 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:13 pm
@King4life, carlyle?
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King4life Reply:
December 8th, 2011 at 7:36 am
@tornado12, Ha!
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Here’s my 2 cents worth…
I’ve actually seen incremental improvement in the Kings over the last couple of games. Lsst night against the Ducks, there were occassions when the Kings played with greater coherence in the OZone and were just an RCH from scoring.
Also, they played with a bit more urgency/ tempo/ awareness, all these being part of the “attitude”, than what’s been too many lethargic stretches this season.
Given Doughty’s holdout, the European trip, wholesale roster changes, Penner’s slow start, Richard’s injury, AMart’s injury, Voynov’s unnecessary fall-foliage junket, the 3-SO Quick gufaw, Fox’s pea-in-whisle malfunction, Bob’s mistaken identity, and DL’s denial, (wheewwwwwwww!), yes it’s a circus, but enough excuses already!
I see TM actually trying to “tweak” the system somewhat in order to promote offensive production, but it’s only happening in fits-and-starts. Unless there’s a clear view of what changes will be made and engrained soon, this could spin out of control rather quickly. The other variable is that in order to improve on offense as a team, there will be some defensive concessions. Meaning that, over the next few month or two, there will be games in which the Kings will give up 4 or 5 goals as a consequence of trying some sexy new offensive wrinkles.
All in all I would call for some patience and perhaps some sort of ultimatum for the coaching staff. Quantifiable criteria such as both making the playoffs and at least winning a series should be minimum qualifications. I think it would be somewhat rash for DL to pull the plug at this juncture.
Flame away!
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Thanks for the interview Rich. I guess we just wait and see. DL is a smart guy. If he is willing to go down with this ship then I’ll shut up and watch.
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Rich, thank you for listening to us and asking these questions.
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I’ve been a big supporter of you Lombardi and appreciate what you’ve brought to the team, but… That’s why it hurts to hear these nebulous, veiled responses. You’ve always been forthcoming about the plans you had. In your roundabout way you would always seem to give an honest take but this interview is just simply denial.
Denial that your plan may be flawed.
Denial that you may have brought in or relied on the wrong players to be the teams backbone.
Denial that your coaching staff has failed to change with the times.
Denial that this “defensive structure” is in reality a word to shield our eyes from the truth: without John Quick, this team sits in LAST PLACE, easy.
Denial that “it’s so important for the playoffs” since it’s been in the playoffs 2 straight years with the same result.
Like you’ve tried to sell us “The Time Is Now”, it’s time for action. Things aren’t going to work magically themselves out. If the players aren’t doing things “the right way” it’s your job to make sure they sure as hell start doing it. It all starts with YOU. Take responsibility instead of distributing it.
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kinginsaltlake Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 6:32 pm
@xeropoint, Very good post. My hope is that those who need to hear your voice will listen.
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Choralone Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 11:10 pm
@kinginsaltlake, You guys know that “The Time is Now” was cooked up by the marketing department, right? I don’t think Dean answers to them.
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This is the smartest thing that Lombardi said; “part of producing offense is being able to be there to support each other on the puck, getting open so that when someone has the puck, you’re open for him in a scoring position. Going to the net and creating space and rebounds is a fundamental part of support. When we’re in on the forecheck, that second man has to be closer and that third man has to be willing to jump. That is something that, no question, we have to improve on”
So Deano, its obvious that this team isn’t doing this under TM’s leadership! That’s the key to a successful offense…and since we have the players that your hand-picked…Why aren’t we executing?
Hint: TM
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Lanny McDonald's 'Stache Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:38 pm
@silk,
I agree, but then again I have no doubt that TM is asking his forwards to go to the dirty areas down low to support the play… but once the player is over the boards, the coach can’t physically put him in front of the net. We’re missing gritty, fearless guys like Zeus and Simmer who will go to these areas and make the rest of the team look good. Stoll tried to go to the net a bit last night but doesn’t have the body type for it. Brown does sometimes but shys away from it in general because he doesn’t like getting chopped and slashed in the crease too much. Mike Richards has gone there numerous times, which is a testament to his character, but we can’t afford to have him taking damage in that area of the ice when he’s such a crucial part of the team. Gagne, great player, but good luck getting that guy to play a hard-nosed game in the crease.
Bottom line, we should have traded Stoll and signed Zeus… but hindsight is 20/20
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Silk Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 7:10 pm
@Lanny McDonald’s ‘Stache,
I agree with your comments, however, I am more concerned about our guys not filling the open lanes in the slot (between defense) readying themselves for one timers. I’m not really expecting our smaller guys to hang out in front of the crease for the reasons you identified. They need to get open in the scoring areas just like Robitaille did his whole career. Look at the way the Blackhawks, Detroit and Vancouver move in the offensive zone. They always have players moving to the open areas for quick passes. Richards and Gagne get it, but they are the only ones on our team. (Kopitar could also improve in this area.)
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flex Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 6:44 pm
@silk, Good!! like this ..”and since we have the players that your hand-picked…Why aren’t”
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KingK@ King4life, Carlysle. He’s WON a Cup in the post- lockout era. Another question: Why does the Kings’ attack look the same in the 1st period 0-0 as it does when trailing in the 3rd period? Murray has to go.
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If TM is such a great coach? Why are there numerouse former Kings players around the league who seem to always do alot better scoring and seem to always have break out years. Could it be TM is so worried about defence he can’t coach offence? As this team is right now, it will not make the play offs.
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Mik3ysfv Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 5:52 pm
@gene, here here. Purcell, Boyle, Moulson, Poni etc. And the forwards who’ve destr: ucted since being under Murray: Halpern, Penner, Modin, Moreau, Stoll, and Clifford’s reward for being the high scorer in the playoffs? The rug pulled out from under him.
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Thank you so much for the interview!
I wondering if there are players who are getting frustrated with the coaching or is everything ok in the clubhouse?
And I wonder if TM’s job is really in jeopardy or no change would be made until the off-season..
thnks!
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The most revealing phrase in the entire interview was “I don’t want to lose one iota defensively”.
Translation-I have a defense first plan. TM has delivered on my plan. We’re not changing our fundamental approach and TM is not at risk at this time.”
It reminds me of the old Chicago Bears that were all defense and no offense. One time Dick Butkus intercepted a pass and took it in for a touchdown and then ran offer to the offensive group and said, “Now go out there and hold ‘em.”
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Thanks Rich…appreciate you reiterating your original question…even though DL seemed to dodge it again. It seems as thought DL isn’t quite ready to do anything about the current funk the team is in. He acknowledged the fact that he purposely signed guys in the off season to improve the offense and spoke about how they are comitted to the defensive structure…so, I guess he is just as frustrated as many of us are on this blog…The difference is, he is not a blogger…he is the GM of this team…the man solely responsible for the hiring of player and coaching personel…he , unlike the rest of us, is in a position to do something about this situation and the lack of offense…
You know…2 years ago all I heard was how DL “liked this group” and wasn’t prepared to trade away the future…heard it again last year…so then what happened?
Why did you suddenly trade away some pieces when before you were so against breaking up the group.
Listen, I was for a lot of what DL did initially…I thought the trade for Penner was a positive step…We all can agree with the Richards deal…the pick up of Gagne sounded great and Moreau and Hunter were fill ins that I wasn’t upset with…but now we are not getting any production from anyone! It’s not working and being frustrated about it isn’t working either…Leave that to us…it is your job to do something about it
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Silk Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 7:13 pm
@g smith86, You are Spot On!
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Of course,Dl needs to show up calm and be diplomatic.The Good news is he recognize that this is also coachs problem.Very good!!! We all understand he is Gm (not radio comentator,who btw are doing great job,exept calling TM performance…you know) he can say that this is ALSO,coaches job. I feel he is already started looking for “the right one”(not an easy thing ,btw) But who knows,maybe there is still someone availabe among the former kings..like Balsma ,Tippet…who knows)
If this attidute will continue next a few games I think we can get a Cristmas Gift..someone who has better attidute and most importat ,got better knowlage about todays NHL system. I do not think he will wait until the end,because ..it is simple,everybody knows THE Time is NOW!!!
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From DL: “When we’re in on the forecheck, that second man has to be closer and that third man has to be willing to jump. That is something that, no question, we have to improve on.”
THAT’S the rub right there. You want good defense, so you stress that the players should play back, be safe positionally. So they are taught not to be closer and not to jump. That’s the system. Plus, because we dump it in so often, other teams know this and are already on their way to take the dumped puck before we even dump it in. Hard for the first guy, let alone the 2nd, to retrieve the puck. That too is a product of the system. We’re one-dimensional because the coach is. Other teams have us figured out, but the players are being told to compensate for their coach’s lack of creativity.
The players also don’t have a coach whose got their backs if their “jumping” goes wrong. Instead, you hear about mistakes and needing to be better positionally.
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Silk Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 7:17 pm
@BringBackTheShieldJersey, Great points.
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If the kings start putting in the garbage goals great, point production is up. That does not change the fact this style of play is excrutiatingly boring. I will never pay to see this team if I have to sit through this boring system, unless Edmonton, Buffalo, Colorado, Vancover, Pens,caps, Rangers, or Tampa are in town. Wow look all the teams that play exciting hockey! That how to grow the game. Hopefully when telivised on the major networks they don’t play the kings. That can only hurt this sport. Wake up
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Mr Hammond unfortunately reading your interview with Dean Lombardi read more like Iranian state run TV than an objective interview. As a Kings employee are you able to ask the really tough questions and then report the answers. I for one, find Dean Lombardi’s canned answers an insult to my intellegince.
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Cynic Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 9:11 pm
@Jim, I’m not sure how you can put this on Rich? He’s going to ask professional questions as pointed as he can to not be offensive in order to get the most out of Dean (Who usually spills the beans in a roundabout, longwinded way) with his answers. You can;t just go up to someone who doesn;t have to talk to you and say “Hey bud, when you gonna fire the coach? He sucks! huh-huh-huh-huh” Dean would laugh his butt off and just walk away.
Rich is an employee, but I don’t see him protecting anyone. Dean Lombardi says what he wants most of the time and is not going to jeapordize his professional relationship with his coach to satisfy a bloodlust desire from a fan who doesn’t have to suffer the backlash the next day.
Bottom line, because of Rich’s conduct with the Kings staff, he gets more info than anyone else on the team, it’s not just because he’s ‘The Insider’. If I was Rich, I would take that insinuation as insulting to my journalistic abilities.
Hell, I thought Hammer asked some pretty pointed questions in a way DL could handle. He flat out asked DL if the attitude of the team was on the coaches! I mean, what do you want? Do you want REAL answers or just something that satisfies your frustration? It’s OK, but be honest about it.
Not to jab at you, but I just found it funny that you spelled intelligence incorrectly the way that sentence came out. Not saying you did it purposely, it just reads funny. I botch my spelling all the time.
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CB14 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 9:34 pm
@Jim, What else did you want Rich to ask. He asked about the lack of scoring, the teams’s system, and the coaches. What else is there? Rich is a journalist, not a crazy fan like alot of us here, myself included.
@Rich Hammond, did you just get moderated? LOL. I know how that feels.
For the record, I thought you did a great job in your interview with Dean Lombardi.
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Rich Hammond Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 9:36 pm
Ha…changed my mind. Not worth the aggravation.
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CB14 Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 10:26 pm
@Rich Hammond, I know how you feel. I get that way too sometimes, but most of the time I can’t contain myself like you can.
P.S. If you ever need an interview like the one you (didn’t) mention, I’m your man.
wavesinair Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 10:35 pm
@Rich Hammond,
Ahmadinejad would not approve of this response.
Jim Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 11:06 pm
@Jim, I think that you all are missing the point! The point is that the Kings currently SUCK! They are the worst offensive team in the league and nobody seems to care. Least of all Lombardi! Go ahead all of you, languish in mediocrity!!
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Choralone Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 11:14 pm
@Jim, Of course. No one cares as much as you. Congrats, superfan!
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Jim Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 11:26 pm
@Choralone, Hi Choralone! Please don’t miss understand me. When I say “nobody seems to care”, I mean the Kings management. I am not trying to take things out on Rich Hammond either. I am just extremely frustrated over the way the Kings are playing! I know that most other fans must feel the same way. I don’t understand the organization can just stay the course! When most of the players are in a “slump”, that is an indication of a bigger problem. Wouldn’t you agree? I apologize to anyone that I have iritated! Just a frustrated and passionate Kings fan i guess.
Bkrs-Bud Reply:
December 8th, 2011 at 8:57 am
@Jim, Sounds like you need to take a break.
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It sounds like TM’s job is safe. I hope the team can change enough to score more. But there does seem to be some frustration with the players. I know Ryan Smyth had connections to Edmonton, but he REALLY has come to life there—like a big weight was lifted off his shoulders when he left the Kings.
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I’d maybe like a little bit of smack talk “at” the coaches and players (in private of course). Let them and us (fans) know that there’s gonna be some changes made if either the system or the players don’t start scoring more goals.
I’m also beginning to ask myslef what it is that King’s management sees in Loktionov to make him their number one “ready now” forward to bring up. If he’s it, we could be lacking at manchester.
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We all want our tough, hard working KINGS back, and SOON!!!!
Go KINGS Go!!!
Start being more selfish guys, someone does need to be the MAN, KOPITAR you have ALL the requirements dude, go out and be MAD, MEAN, TOUGH, FAST…….get the edge you’ve always needed, no more MR nice guy. Pissed off about losing is great motivation, but please LA KINGS, start winning some damn games.
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Great interview Rich.
A lot of what Dean said in his DoubleGood EvilSpeak confirms what Waves and I posted about earlier today that there is something SERIOUSLY wrong with the mental part of this team. My belief is that it stems from the player’s confusion of TM’s entrenched defensive system and DL’s admission he does not want one iots of movement from it, and TM’s attempt at an offensive system that will mesh with that defensive system, but not change it.
The experiment is going horribly wrong and if the offense is going to come, I think the defensive system may have to be tweaked to allow an offensive system from TM to work. This is a reason I believe TM’s days are numbered. By the way DL spoke today, it may not be entirely TM’s fault if he is being directed to not change the defensive system AT ALL by Dean. There may not be an offensive system that will work with this tight defense first system, and therefore, TM’s hands could be tied.
This gets more insane every day….but I think we’re inching closer to understanding the REAL problem(s) here.
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King John Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 9:57 pm
@Cynic, If DL does NOT want to move away one iota from the defensive system (my take too), then why do you think TM’s days are numbered, since TM is doing what DL wants?
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Cynic Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 10:21 pm
@King John, Simple and a good question really. If things stay status quo, someone is going to go. Do you think it’ll be TM or DL?
Even if DL ties TM’s hands to force him to find a way to integrate an offensive system into what we have now without changing it (I don’t see how it’s possible as backheavy as our d- plays with the ‘Home Plate’ Mentality we have). When it fails, TM will take the fall. DL has more value to the ownership than TM does, and that’s the way it should be IMO.
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flex Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 10:49 pm
@Cynic, Also,if this so called attidute will continue ,soon or later DL would be on the hot sit,because he is the one who promised build a good team (and basily he did) in 3-4 years.Fans does not have to understand all details of pro hockey (like our coach ??).Fans would ask THE ANSWER. So,Dl knows his Time to be accounable will soon or later arrive.I was in Monreal game and there was a lot of empty sits and at list 25/30% Montreal fans. BTW I think those emty sits in quack pond wre the main reson for new coach.
This brings me to ask the question… Who’s missing? I mean what player that we don’t have could bring it all together? Is it an agitator? I mean Westy is a nice guy (I think that says it all when your “enforcer” is a nice guy). Brown doesn’t (can’t?) hit like he used to because he’ll get suspended. We don’t have Ryan Smyth camped out in front of the net anymore (or Zeus or Simmonds). Is this team as good as we had hoped? Trent Hunter? Ethan Moreau? Gagne? Instead of Zeus, Poni, Simmonds? Smyth? DL also needs to look in the mirror. I think he has some ‘splanin to do same as Murray does.
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flex Reply:
December 7th, 2011 at 10:33 pm
@Duckbasher, ..also ,do not forget Frolov (like him or not) he was 25-32 regular goal scorer.without any real replacer we lost him and yes,of course Zeus is missing in front of the net.but ,it would be more accurate to ask ..what is missing ? than who is missing.
System? There is no system .Brown made some good points.Move the puck as unit.I do not see team as unit.seems almost everybody is confused.We keep listening the same old thing..”shot menality..good advise for kids…”son shoot the puck you never know what is going to happen.In the courthous two withneses are enough for a jugment..In Lost angeles kings case most of those player who left this team under Tm all of sudden becoming goal scorers…Molson.Poni, same smith,purcel,Boyl…
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What DL is saying is that players do not respond to TM anymore and they need to adjust their attitudes that they should. Typical GM covering for his coach, cause DL job is on the line as well.
DL is hancuffed this year because of cap space, next year is pivitol, if he dosn’t get our team scoring he may be gone.
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Number one, no question, we set out to put a strong defensive structure in place, because there’s no doubt in my mind that it starts back there and it’s critical for the playoffs.
You only have to worry about winning in the playoffs if you get there. You ass is now on the line too DL. I hope you recognize that. Losing record doesn’t usually equal playoff appearances.
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Wow. Just finished the article. DL should be a politician because they’re expected to blow smoke and not take responsibility. I wanted to believe it was TM, but it goes above him too. Dammit!
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It’s really sad to admit that I don’t even want to watch the game tonight. I can’t bear to see this ” pathetic system” in action another day. Even if we score 5 goals tonight- it doesn’t change anything except to buy DL and TM some more time. (Even a blind squirrel finds an acorn once and a while.)
And I am an avid Kings fan! I can tell you all; if I am feeling this way…..this organization is in big trouble.
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Bkrs-Bud Reply:
December 8th, 2011 at 9:23 am
@Silk, I know i will be watching, it is to early to be giving up.
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This was a whole lot of nothing.
Rich what did DO have to say about replacing TM?
It’s on everyone’s mind
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DL not DO
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DL is spot on in regards to the offensive second and third man support. I get the sense – reading between the lines – that DL is starting to see an issue with our system as well, but he’s careful in choosing his responses at this point.
Just watch Boston play and the “second and third man support” will become crystal clear as to what this is supposed to look like. They are one of the best I’ve seen at second and third man support on offense. They come after you in the O-zone. It’s friggin’ awesome! We have the talent here, but like a broken record, I truly believe it is the system here that is holding us back…
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