Picking up the Dean Lombardi interview again, here are some thoughts on how Lombardi intends to improve the Kings this summer. Of course, all of this could be altered depending on the status of Ryan Smyth, but the basics of this remain the same…
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Question: When you’ve talked in the past about improving the team, first and foremost it’s been about the improvement of the young players. You don’t have your “boxes” on the whiteboard anymore, but at this point, I’d have to think those boxes are pretty much filled. So now, when you look at upgrading some of those boxes, making the team stronger, how much do you look for outside help — trades, free agency — and how much do you put the emphasis on internal improvement?
LOMBARDI: “That’s your first and foremost. Kopitar, all those guys. We talked about Drew and how he went a little backward, but I thoroughly expect him to bounce back. That’s one of the advantages. We were the youngest team in the playoffs. In some cases that’s a disadvantage, because experience is valuable. On the other hand, we’ve clearly got upside. As far as the boxes, without saying a lot here (about specific players), the situation is not a lot different than it was at the trade deadline. I’m also finding, based on my discussions (with GMs) is that, like the trade deadline, there’s not a lot of options. There are some things we’re looking at, but it’s not a lot different than the trade deadline. I think it’s been well-documented. The numbers on defense speak for themselves, between the goaltending the defense. There’s a nice mix and it has already proven to be one of the top crews in the league, statistically as well as subjectively. Now, our goals for, at even strength, that needs to improve. That 145 or 146 [actually 148], we have to raise that. That is usually a real strong indicator of whether you’re solid.
“Those numbers work out, when you see that the top teams in 5-on-5 scoring were Boston and Vancouver. When you have that type of strength, to be able to play 5-on-5, that’s a big part of the playoffs if you’re going to go through the wars. So when you look at our team, I believe we were at 145. That’s got to improve. Secondly, I think it’s fair to say that the power play from the first half (of the season) was good, and then it really dropped off. We have to improve that, to where it was in the first half of the season, all the time. So when you look at our team, on the macro level, clearly the defense is a nice mix. The numbers bear that out. Where are you lacking? It’s not only what you’re watching, but the numbers bear out that offensively we have to improve. Did we know this going into last year? Yeah. We obviously looked at some things. The trade deadline was very similar to what we’re looking at now. Like I’ve always said, you can’t just snap your fingers and get the right player. I’ve also said that, in terms of the ability to be active, your options are more limited because, as you said, there aren’t many boxes to fill. In my first year sitting here, we signed five free agents and I remember telling you at the time, `This is not good.’ Because we were filling a lot of boxes. That’s what it is saying. So it’s nice to look busy, but trust me, we’re very busy in terms of trying to fill this. It just doesn’t always look that way, because it’s harder. It’s a more limited market, in terms of what we’re looking for and what’s abatable. But you keep plugging away. The one good thing, as we plug away at it, is that two of our best prospects have some of the dimensions we’re lacking, in Schenn and Loktionov. But it’s fair to say they’re going to need some time to figure it out.”
Question: But in saying that, that the potential is there internally, you’re still looking for outside help, right?
LOMBARDI: “I still think we need to improve that. We gave up some young talent to get Dustin Penner. Not only does Dustin need to take strides here, but regardless, I’d still be looking to improve facets of our offense. As I said, there is some hope there from within. There’s a very strong chance they will be there in the future. The problem is, as we all know, is that to put a kid in a top-six role early, traditionally it isn’t good odds. So all I’m saying is that if we can’t get the right guy, at least there is hope there on the horizon. That being said, we’re in a position now — as we already showed at the trade deadline — that we will now get aggressive for the right guy. We took one step at the deadline, but even despite that step, and even if that had worked the way we would have anticipated — we still think we’re going to be able to get to where Dustin belongs — but even with that happening, we’re still looking to add to this group, in terms of this offense.”
Pour me more koolaide Deano, I’m addicted!
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We heard the same thing about the PP prior to the start of last season and nothing was done to improve it. As many will say, this is the one instance where DL needs to make a “deacquistion” and find us an assistant coach who can improve both our 5 on 5 and PP scoring (getting Parise would help also).
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lafan13 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 9:31 am
@DesertKing,
we’re not getting parise = /
Only player we have a chance of getting is richards, and i would assume that could only happen if we get smyth off the books, and offer richards a kovalchuck type deal that he cannot refuse…
Is it worth it??!?!?
ps. dean should offersheet the hell outa tampa bay and “yoink” stamkos
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Action Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 9:36 am
@lafan13,
Lombardi could sign Stamkos to an offer sheet that would give him the moon and Yzerman is matching it. There is literally no chance of that happening.
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DesertKing Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 9:41 am
@lafan13,
I keep saying that a “sign and trade” for Parise would be good for both NJ and us. It has happened before and since everyone is in agreement that this year’s UFA group is not very good or deep and this year’s draft has the same issues, then creative maneuvers such as “sign and trades” could be the key to success for teams looking to make upgrades. Even with the higher cap, NJ cannot afford what Parise is going to be seeking do to Kovalsuk’s contract, unless they want a repeat of last season where they were only dressing 15 players for a game. DL has made it very plain that he will not make an offer on another team’s RFA and he will respect the unwritten rule that GM’s don’t do that to each other, so as much as I and every other Kings fan would love to see Stamkos wearing our uniform, that is one acquistion I don’t see happening. TB has cap space and can afford to keep him and Yzerman ain’t no dummy. I am still not sold that Richards is the answer to our needs.
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Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 9:55 am
@DesertKing, Parise isn’t leaving NJ – no way. and Stamkos isn’t leaving TB. the odds of getting the #1 guy out of a city when they are in their early 20s is almost zero. it’s guys like Richards that are in their prime and nearing the end of it that can be had.
Jeff Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 10:06 am
@DesertKing, For now Parise is gonna get a 1 yr contract in arbitration. There is no way NJ is trading him now. Now come Feb/March depending on where NJ is in the standings and where they are in negotiations with Parise, we might be able to obtain him then at the deadline. It should be at a point at that time whether or not Parise will stay a devil or want out. There is no way they will let him walk for nothing. I can’t imagine Lou ending up in a situation where he trades his rights in June, for basically nothing. He will either be a devil for life or traded at the deadline.
Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 10:58 am
@DesertKing,
There is no way to do a sign and trade right now, because that would be tampering. The Kings can’t even negotiate Parise’s future with NJ, or contact them about working out a future caphit so they can get New Jersey to sign him then trade him to us.
New Jersey wouldn’t negotiate a longterm deal just to make him more attractive as tradebait either, because Parise would never sign it, knowing he has free agency looming in a year, and could negotiate whatever deal he wants, with whomever he wants, once his contract is up with New Jersey.
kingfish Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:53 am
@DesertKing,
agreed, theres gotta be a trade there for parise. Bernier, JJ, simmonds, prospects, picks. Not all of of those but some combination. And yeah no way DL offer sheets another teams RFA. There seams to be a code amongst many GMs that you just dont do that. Kevin Lowe wasnt one of them
kingfish Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:57 am
@DesertKing,
agreed there has to be a trade there for parise. bernier, JJ simmmonds, prospects picks. Not all but some combination of those. And yeah DL would never offer sheet another teams RFA, there seems to be a code amongst many GM’s that you just dont do that. Kevin Lowe wasnt one of them
centericeman Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 12:07 pm
@DesertKing, Last year he had 28 goals and 77 points!
He has a stanley cup ring, and is absolutly a man on the power play.
What exactly are you considering him to be missing?
Parise would cost us just as much, and would cost us players.
Granted all you CAP GEEKS out there with your pocket protectors are going to start drowning on about the cap hit!
cap hit smap hit, sign the dude and get a cup.
We have as much cap space as anyone, and if Richards is really looking to get into stanley cup contention I really don’t see all that many teams competing for his services. It is a small list.
number 6 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:10 pm
@DesertKing,
You say ‘sign and trade’ like it’s jump and then down into push up position. up….. down into push up position. Look…… DL LEARNED a lot of what he knows from Lou Lamoriello. And if you’re saying trade Doughty and maybe two firsts and another player to NJ for Parise, yeah, I’ll bet Lou might even go for that. But would YOU be happy with that trade?
Sorry if I’m being a bit brusk with you, but really whether you mean it or not (and I’ll assume you Don’t) – sign and trade…. it’s PARISE for cryin out loud. Otherwise what were you thinking? Bernier straight up for Parise? Like Lou Lamoriello who is the best GM in hockey would do that?
Again, don’t mean to come down on you, but so many people on this site say ‘yeah, let’s get Parise’. Me, I’d love to get a new BMW and a Bosendorfer piano next week, but it’s not likely to happen.
DesertKing Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 9:51 pm
@number 6
No problem number 6, you can have a BMW and a Bosendorfer piano (?), you just need to have the financial ability or circumstances to accomplish it. Just look at NJ’s financial status and the fact that Lou is no longer calling the player/personnel shots, their crazy owner is. You are right, we are talking about PARISE, aka, “We can’t afford him in NJ” since they signed Kovalsuk. Will it happen, I don’t know, Could it happen, man, I hope so because it is PARISE. If it doesn’t happen, then I hope DL has something up his sleeve. I could have both of those items that you want, but I prefer to spend my money on Kings tickets (besides, I got no room for the piano and the BMW can’t tow my wakeboard boat). Different strokes for different folks, but we are all Kings fans and need to keep the faith.
KingMe20 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 10:06 am
@lafan13,
He’s gotta sign Doughty and Simmonds first before he can even consider trying to do that with Stamkos, but even with the rumors going around that Tampa could have trouble re-signing him, the likelihood of them not matching the offer is extremely low.
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DesertKing Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 12:16 pm
@DesertKing,
A lot of great comments above. As usual, I learned a whole bunch of new stuff and confirmed the reasons why I am not a NHL GM
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We need a Decent player to score a PP goal and we need to be better than we were last year and this year.So next seaosn we need to be number 1 in out division they can do it we all know it.The Sharks struggle to get it this year.Once u smell blood from that team u go after the kill that how i see it and hopefully everyone see it to.If they bleeding u go after him like there no tomorrow.
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Eberlin Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 12:52 pm
@KingsFanFTW, I think we have talented players on the power play…I was more concerned about the PP plan itself. As a player, you can only go out there and execute what the coaches drilled into your brain in practice. That is, pass it to the point and let them shoot. I don’t care how gifted you are, if you’re a Kopitar with your skates up against the half-wall, not a lot is going to happen for you or your PP stats.
Not that I don’t want a proven sniper on the team, of course — just that it might actually be the system that prevents said sniper from doing his thing.
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KingsFanFTW Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:06 pm
@Eberlin, ok that is true i just want this team out of first round to go to 2nd round plsu with the Division title
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I wonder at what point he’d be willing to over pay for a player in a trade. I dont know how far this team is from being a serious contender. Kopitar’s injury really blurred things. If the kings lost with him in the line up, then maybe you give them more time to develop internally. If they had won with him in the line up, then you step it up and pay a little more than you’d like to get some help for the team to get to the next level. Since he didn’t play, we all can speculate that the kings would have beat the sharks, but we cant say for sure. Deano is a tough spot. At this point, as long as it doesn’t include schenn, i say make the trade no matter which prospect is invovled. and even schenn if a top line guy is coming back, say a malkin (i’m just throwing a name out there, not saying schenn = malkin)
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Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:14 am
@FKA PakiFro,
Deano has already crossed that threshhold, last season, when he traded for Penner. He’s just backing that up by saying he’s not done yet. That trade showed that he isn’t just looking at trying to aquire midlevel, or transitional players anymore, but is serious about getting guys who are considered top end guys (Wether Penner actually pans out, or not, doesn’t change the fact that DL stuck his neck out, and made the move, to go for the best guy available at the time, and paid a healthy price to get him).
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Garrett Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 9:51 pm
@FKA PakiFro, I keep trying to tell people…. We over value our players and the ease at which a deal can be pulled off! Unless you are putting Doughnuts on the table, guys like Parise are simply out. Cry all you want about how DL would never do that, but when you say he will never trade DD, you are also saying we will not make a move for a fourth goal scorer – case closed.
Open your minds for jus a moment and realize that if we put DD on the table, a buffet opens…
Now, everyone say I’m nuts, fine. But then kiss any major move bye bye. And for the record, add Bernie to the mix and you can really lock up some offensive talent, plus signing Richards. That s a cup contender tomorrow.
You can’t get something for nothing, tis my only point.
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Garrett Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 9:53 pm
@Garrett, Fourty goal scorer, not fourth.
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That deadline deal for Penner should have opened a lot of eyes.
If you have good, young talent that you really believe in, DON’T go trading that talent for someone else’s headache. I’m not saying that Teubert or the pick would amount to much, but Penner was what others said he was..a headache! The grass is not always greener on the other side.
Allow the kids time to develop and become winners in your organization.
We’re a young enough team that the kids have time to develop. As much as I want to win the cup this year, it’s still a process that the team needs to go thru. Rome wasn’t built in 4 years. Besides it had to be easier to build Rome than it did to turn around the Kings organization that Lombardi started with.
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fsd1 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 10:06 am
@nykingfan, Penner is not a bust like so many people claim, unless he comes into camp slow, fat and stupid which i doubt very much he can and will be a productive King IMHO
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KingsFanFTW Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 10:49 am
@fsd1, LOL sorry but slow fat and stupid wow that just funny
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nykingfan Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:52 am
@fsd1,
I hope you’re right, but his playoff performance was certainly bust-like!
I loved the trade at the deadline like most others. But what we were expecting was not what we saw…for whatever reason.
Part of the problem is in today’s game, all teams play a system. You’re asking a top player to forget what he’s been doing and conform to the system. Those players are all creatures of habit.
The Kovalchuk trade to the Devils was a classic example…
Still..shame on Penner for not giving much of an effort. He owes all of us fans who either purchased tickets or invested time watching him play, a huge bounce back year!
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number 6 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:18 pm
@nykingfan,
Yep, NYKF (not DKNY), I do lose my patience sometimes with this stuff, but I suppose every single team’s fans do the same thing. Hey, how bout we trade Greener, (fantastic guy, good teammate, tough) and let’s throw in a 5th rounder …. hmmmm, maybe we should make that a 4th and we’ll give it all up to get Parise. Yeah, Lou is just sitting watching his telephone waiting for the moment DL makes that offer!
You Are Right. It’s simply Not That Easy. I said the other day and I think it might have been CB14 who picked up on my comments and said the same…… the Only guy who in three years felt really right for the Kings and their needs up front was Hossa, and there was No Way we’d get him after two consecutive appearances and losses in the finals, he wanted a Cup. Well, he made the right choice. Otherwise DL was absolutely spot on wrt Heatley, Kovalchuck (he offered More than enough money…. now look at the bind that Lou is in wrt the cap), others saying they want Spezza who is Weak defensively.
If it was that easy everybody would do it. If anything the area i would tend to criticize is that in his quest for certain types of players he’s overlooked available players in the first round such as Claude Giroux (wo I think is a genius with the puck) and Logan Couture as he was so bent on getting a dman (who may or may not make the big club). Then again the Kings weren’t the only team to miss these guys.
Shotongoal Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:48 pm
@nykingfan, I have to disagree, the Kings do have some good, young talent, but that wasn’t going to be enough to propel them into a Cup contender last season. And, it probably won’t be enough to push them towards the Cup next season. Penner was a gamble that needed to be made. The fact that HE wasn’t motivated, ready, willing, or whatever, was not the Kings fault. Look at Boston, they brought in some veteran players at the trade deadline, or near it, and those players fit into valuable roles for them during their run for the Cup. DL was doing the same with the Penner trade, and I hope he will look to do the same this offseason whether via trade or FA’s. As far as Rome not being built in 4 years, how about no Cup for 45 years??!!
There was really not “talent” spent on Penner, just a D-man in an already deep D-man organ-I-zation. I’m all for letting the young talent blossom, but without veteran know-how and playoff experience Rome will never get built!
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nykingfan Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 2:31 pm
@Shotongoal,
I think the difference with the Kings and Boston is we were looking to bring in a big time scorer..certainly a top 6 guy. Boston brought in ancillary pieces to fit around what they already had.
I don’t think we’re that much different than Boston other than experience. They’re not the msot talented team in the league, but they played as a team and used their size and physicality to win that series. We can do the same. Quick would need to be Tim Thomas as well.
I know we haven’t won a cup in 45 years, but I take each regime separately. It’s not DL’s fault that Taylor/McMaster/etc were disasters who didn’t think ahead to build for the future.
I want to bring in someone as well. I just want to make sure it’s the right guy, for the right price.
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Osaka Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 4:37 pm
@nykingfan, Not true, Boston picked up their number one center Horton last summer. They traded for Kaberle at the deadline. In the past acquiring Savard and Chara, trading Kessel….. they have always been aggressive and have made big moves within the last year.
Osaka Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 5:35 pm
@nykingfan, Penner played 20 something games and he was a bust? Talk about a quick trigger fingure. He has played 5 full seasons in the league, let’s judge him on that. Didn’t Kopi go 20 games without scoring? I know Penner didn’t look good and of course everyone wanted better results, but he came to a new team and struggled. Didn’t Boston also give up a first round pick for Kaberle? Oh also a second rounder and a prospect. He struggled right? He is now a UFA. Penner is under contract. Boston took more of a risk, that is what you need to do to make a run in the playoffs. A bunch of young prospects are of no use to a team if they are not played. If there isn’t space on the roster the only way to get value is to move those players. That is why they are called assets. Also how many young players do you want on the team? This is not the AHL. I don’t want to see the Kings play 3 rookies on their roster each year, I hope we are past that.
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Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 8:19 pm
@Osaka, sorry, logic and common sense doesn’t work here
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nykingfan Reply:
June 22nd, 2011 at 8:07 am
@Osaka,
Re the Horton pickup…I was talking about the trade deadline moves and the problems that come with those moves. Horton was an off season pickup if I recall correctly. At leeast he had a chance to go thru a full training camp and learn the Bruins system. the learning curve is much greater when the mvoes are made off season than trade deadline deals.
Kaberle was brought in to improve their PP..He wasn’t brought in to be a top 2 D/man..He ended up being a #5 or 56 D-man by the end.
If you can grade Penner’s performance over those 20+ games as anything short of bust-like, more pwoer to you. I don’t care about what he’s done over his career..it has no bearing on OUR team. I only care about what he does for the Kings.
He needs to come back and have a huge year this year. But don’t suagar-coat his performance after the trade. It was a notch below terrible. It seemed pretty clear to all that the effort wasn’t there. Their is no excuse for that!
How is the risk of trading the last pick overall more of a risk than the Kings giving up a mid to late 1st rd pick? Considering how Kaberle played, aren’t the Bruins better off that he’s a UFA?
If Penner plays the way he did last year, wouldn’t we have been b etter off getting him as a 1 year rental?
In the end it all depends on what Penner does this season for the Kings. His “honeymoon” period came to a crashing end with kings fans. He either puts up or gets out this year.
I also understand what you’re saying about a bunch of young players playing on your team, but Boston allowed their guys to mature. This wasn’t a 1 year shot for the Bruins. They have built there team well, but it didn’t happen overnite. The young kids needed time to mature before they would be ready to win a cup. They have also added in veets along the way to help and some crafty trades (ripping off Toronto)
Same thing is going on in LA IMO
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Is it me or does Lombardi blab on and on and on and doesn’t really say much? I still don’t know what he’s saying. He never answers a question directly. He talks in circles.
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fsd1 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 10:07 am
@Steve Jensen, It is called tampering if he states too much.
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jayhay Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:29 am
@Steve Jensen, well if you look at his answers on a macro level, their telling a story of how he wants to add a guy but not a lot is there. Much like at the deadline.
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PT Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 12:50 pm
@Steve Jensen,
That’s why I read about one paragraph and stopped. He should be a politician (I guess in a away, he is)
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Marc Nathan Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:19 pm
@Steve Jensen, He’s pretty full of himself for a guy who has yet to get out of the first round in five seasons in the #2 market in the USA… I like Dean, I like the direction, but I also liked Eddie Haskell on Leave It To Beaver…
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It just doesn’t seem like DL believes we can attain the free agents that could fill the gap in our offense. Almost as if he’s given up, and he sounds hell bent on raising our own. So by the time Loktionov and Schenn are ready, where will today’s stars be? Ugh!
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Jeff Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 10:19 am
@Brownkingsfan, DL can’t talk about players that are not on the Kings or UFAs because that is tampering or could be considered tampering. When DL speaks you have to read carefully what he says (or listen). You have to read between the lines. There is a method to his madness with his long winded answers. There is no doubt in my mind that they will be after Richards. Whether they get him or not is another story, but Richards is exactly the type of player that Lombardi has stated he is looking for, for the 5 yrs he’s been here. He is a Stanley Cup winner, he is a stanley cup MVP, he makes the players around him better, he is the all around player. He almost single handily got Dallas into the playoffs. Put him on the Kings and the Kings offense will be much better.
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Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:21 am
@Brownkingsfan,
He didn’t say anything like that. He said “we’re in a position now — as we already showed at the trade deadline — that we will now get aggressive for the right guy”. He said that internally we have guys “on the horizon”, but “even with that happening, we’re still looking to add to this group, in terms of this offense.”
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I wouldn’t expect too much unless another team is desperate. Dean will improve the team but don’t expect a home run unless a team is willing to serve up a fat one right down the middle. I would not pay Richards more than Kopi out of principle. DL has been firm in the fact that he will not give up our top tier prospects for something small so GM’s know we will help them get rid of salary but they better help us.
I’d also like to point out that part of the problem with the power play was the players and lack of speed and skill. Notice SPEED and SKILL. We add one player to the PP with both and we move to the top. It’s not all the asst. coaches fault.
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number 6 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:22 pm
@Christian T,
I posed two questions to Rich regarding speed and skill, or as you say: SPEED and SKILL. I’m curious to see if that will be dealt with in any of the upcoming posts, because you’re right – it’s not only an issue…… it’s a Huge Issue!!
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RLane420 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:27 pm
@Christian T, when players do the same exact thing over and over for an entire year they are being coached to do this.
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Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:36 pm
@Christian T, i don’t see how speed is a big factor on the power play. it might be a big factor in getting on the power play, but not once you have the man advantage. the power play is about puck movement, traffic and getting shots from good scoring positions. speed is not an important factor in any of those.
i’m not saying the Kings couldn’t use more speed, but speed won’t necessarily make the power play any better.
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BobKnob Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 3:48 pm
@Dave,
x2.
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USHA#17 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 7:02 pm
@Christian T,
The secret of hockey today is build from within and trade some of the overload if the right deal comes up…which is what the Kings did with Penner. The Kings have an excellent body of players coming up with a number of enticing players to spare. It would be a shame to scrap a program in exchange for a perennial 2nd round and out.
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Richards would seem to solve a lot of problems – he would immediately help the power play as he is fantastic on the point. He would help our 5 on 5 as our 2nd line would immediately go from bottom third to top third in the league.
i am not too concerned about the concussion – as far as i know it was his first one and he came back to play after a few weeks. Dallas was very conservative with him and he will have about 6 months since the injury when the season starts. there is no perfect UFA – if there was he wouldn’t be a UFA. everyone has an issue of some sort.
yes, he’s 31, but he’s not a physical style player. there is no reason Richards can’t continue to be very productive into his late 30s.
with the cap going up every year like it has been, signing Richards to a $7M cap hit sounds like a lot now but in 4-5 years it won’t. now, none of us have any idea on whether Richards wants to play here. but he’s a winner, he plays both ends of the ice, he is a character guy and he’s a center which are four major pluses that you couldn’t say about Kovalchuk. as far as i can tell, he’s a DL type of player. he will make the wingers around him better.
i wasn’t on the Richards bandwagon because i didn’t see any way DL could sign him with Smyth sill on the books. but if DL can move Smyth i would feel terrific about the team heading into next year.
DL could re-sign Poni if he wants to play LW since he knows the system and improved as the season went along. remember, quite a few guys took a year before they flourished here.
Penner-Kopitar-Williams
Parse-Richards-Brown
Clifford-Stoll-Simmonds
Richie-Lewis-Westgarth
i’d be confident with that lineup and if Parse struggles DL has assets to make a deal or bring up Schenn. this would also give Schenn and guys like Kozun and opportunity to play their way onto the team. hmmm…Kozun kind of reminds me of St.Louis…who played very well with Richards….hmmmm
anyway, Richards would makes this team better immediately and in my opinion would make the Kings the favorite in the Pacific.
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jet Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:24 am
@Dave, great point wrt players taking a year to fit in here. a Sharks fan lives next door to me, and he believes one of the problems is playing in the pacific. He said it was like 4 months of playoffs before the playoffs, so while the players were mentally sharp, they were physically beat up. And, it was this play that caused the Pacific to lose it’s number 1 centers, Getzlaf, Richards, Kopi, Thorton. There were few easy games for the Pacific teams and unfortunately, that could be the case next year. With Dallas looking for a C1 and the yotes looking for a G1, there could be less than less than 5 teams with 95 points.
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Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:52 am
@jet, i think both Dallas and Phoenix will take steps back this year. Anaheim still has questions in goal with Hiller’s health. if DL can get Richards i think we are clearly the favorite in the Pacific and have a real good shot in the West.
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Alan Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:27 am
@Dave, I like where your head is at with those lines. My only thought is that if Lokti and Schenn are ready to make the step up and we get a guy like Richards, we will have to give up a few people.
I hope this is not the case, but I see someone like Simmonds and Parse as being trade bait. They both have a tremendous upside and would be very appealing to other teams in a package.. Just thinking out loud..
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Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:59 am
@Alan, if DL signs Richards i think he wouldn’t mind having too many centers for # of spots. he has already proven that with d-men.
DL’s philosophy seems pretty clear to me – stock up in the middle of the ice. centermen, d-men and goalies. they are the most valuable commodities in the league and he can make trades for wingers with assets.
just look at the Penner deal. he got a bona fide 30 goal scorer for a late first, a third and the fifth or sixth best d-prospect he had. and he has him for another year. i think that was the key to the Penner deal that everyone keeps forgetting. not only did he get Penner for the stretch run last year (which didn’t work out for a lot of reasons) but for a full year this year.
i think Richards is the kind of guy DL would go all out for. he fits all of DL’s criteria to be a core player and i think he’ll fit into TM’s system.
[Reply]
What is this guy actually saying? Seems like a bunch of words to me and not much substance. Look, just letting you guys know. I haven’t always been on DL and TM, but after this year’s playoffs, I’m personally putting them on a 1 more year clock.
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KingsFanFTW Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 10:51 am
@Poorman, yea but come on DL Didnt expect Kopi to get hurt he got Penner to be the LW for Kopi and then Kopi got hurt so cant really put this Playoff failure on him when his superstar is out for the season
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jet Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:33 am
@KingsFanFTW, How about williams at 80% and half the team had played a half dozen or less playoff games?
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KingsFanFTW Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:06 pm
@jet, true but still next season if we still at the same spot then u can blame the failures on DL
puck73 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:09 am
@Poorman, Fire DL, Fire Murray…wash, rinse, repeat. Tell ya what Jimmy, why dont you come out to the 1st Hammond event and spew that blather live in front of all the regulars and see how that goes over.
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tuan jim Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:52 am
@puck73,
I don’t always agree with you. But this post . . . you’re right on the money.
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RLane420 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:32 pm
@tuan jim, you guys are all crazy ofcorse DL and TM knew and planned for those injuries its compleatly there fault. Its total luck our culture and prospects are in better shape than ever before.
Poorman Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 3:22 pm
@puck73, Look dude. This is not some macchismo moment. I’m as big a Kings Fan as you are. I’m personally flowing with DL and TM one more year. I also don’t sit right with you threatening me for not agreeing with your viewpoint.
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Poorman Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 9:03 pm
@Poorman, suck73
Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:05 pm
@puck73,
I wouldn’t want to get between you guys because I like both of you, but that’s damn funny. LMFAO!
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Poorman Reply:
June 22nd, 2011 at 3:53 am
@Dominick, Dominick, call my show tomorrow, and we’ll talk about suck73. Let him know, he can call in also, and we’ll discuss his uberfan attitude.
Here’s a “mindset” question. Say we get Richards, who is a top line center (right?) What do we do with Kopi? Move him to the 2nd line? And if so, how does that affect Kopi? Does he accept his new role, or does he feel like he got demoted? The obvious answer is to say he accepts his new role, but is there anyone out there, who’s actually played the game and had something similar happen who can put a little more perspective on it?
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fsd1 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:05 am
@Kaiser Soze, Kopi will NOT be a 2nd line center on this team…..
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puck73 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:11 am
@fsd1, Exactly. If Richards signs here he will either center the 2nd line or he can play wing as needed.
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CUP4LA Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:13 am
@Kaiser Soze, I believe Richards would play LW.
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Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:29 am
@CUP4LA,
I try to tell people that, but no one listens. LOL
I guess it doesn’t count when he won a cup playing the left side, because now he’s a center, and that’s all that matters.
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Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:47 am
@Kaiser Soze, i actually think he’ll play center on the #2 line. he did it in Tampa with Vinny being the #1 and Richards the #2. he’ll get a ton of minutes though as he’ll play a ton on the power play.
if you look at the better teams in the league, they don’t push their prospects too quickly. Schenn has only played a handful of games in the AHL and Loktionov has yet to make it through a season w/o an injury. both guys would be best served in a perfect world to play a ton in Manchester and learn the system there.
in 12-13, Stoll’s deal is up and one of those guys takes the #3 center spot (assuming Richards is signed which is a big assumption). in a perfect scenario and they are both healthy and ready to play in the NHL, one can move to wing (Schenn probably) if they need to.
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tuan jim Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 12:02 pm
@Dave,
Why do you harp on this thread and elsewhere about Stoll’s deal ending after next year?
The guy is a sparkler for this team. He’s consistent, increased his goal production this past year, routinely is our best face-off guy — and all the rest of the things I repeatedly praise him for whenever his name is mentioned.
He IS the Kings as much as any other player.
And NOT counted among his goal production are his scores in shoot-outs. Yes, shoot-outs are just a pathetic regular-season-only means of deciding a winner. But Stoll — STOLL, I’m talking about, not Quick or Zus or anybody else — was clutch in those shoot-outs. And it was his goals that got us the extra points we relied on to get into the playoffs.
By the time his current contract ends he’ll still be in his twenties. Do you think he’s gonna try to squeeze $5-mil/per out of the Kings? He’s worth what we already pay him — and more besides.
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Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 12:11 pm
@tuan jim, i like Stoll quite a bit, but if DL signs Richards then Stoll is the #3. he’s a great #3, no doubt about that. again, i like him a lot.
but Schenn will be in the NHL in 2012-13 if not earlier and IF DL signs Richards we will more than likely see Kopitar, Richards, Schenn as the top 3 centers and i don’t see how Stoll would re-sign cheap enough to be a #4 center here.
now, signing Richards is no slam dunk and it’s entirely possible that Stoll does re-sign here as the #3 behind Kopitar and Schenn.
but if DL finds a way to sign Richards i don’t see how Stoll is a King past 2011-12. but again, that is a big IF.
Michael J. Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 12:27 pm
@tuan jim,
About six or eight weeks ago I posted Stoll’s numbers while so many here were ragging on him. His numbers are exactly in the middle of what one would expect from a second-line center. His points amongst centers were 45th in the league. His face-offs were in the top ten. I did not include his shootout numbers.
No, he is not Richards. No, his one timer is not accurate…
But, he is relatively young. He hits. He plays both ends. He will get around $5-mil from someone when his contract is up. And, the Kings will miss him if he leaves.
Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 12:41 pm
@tuan jim,
Couldn’t agree with you more. I try to “go tell it on the mountain” when it comes to Stoll, who is heading into his prime years as a veteran. 28 to 32 is usually when you see the best out of players that have lasted in the NHL, and only Kingsfans consider Stolls best years behind him, or see him as an expendable line item.
The guys only 2 shootout goals away from taking the record away from Jussi Jokinen, on top of all the resons you’ve mentioned. I mentioned the otherday that Stoll is my Darkhorse to have a career year, and just like Williams did this past season, I believe Kingsfans will be counting their lucky stars to have him in the line up.
Maybe not. Some will probably be just as stuborn as ever.
Osaka Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 7:37 pm
@tuan jim, You are looking at it from a fan’s point of view. Every accredited hockey pundit points to the Kings scoring from their number 2 center as being a weekness. It is a fact C2 needs a lot more production. DL has said he wants strength down the middle and a 1, 2 scoring punch with the C1 and C2. Stoll is not that guy. I like Stoll a lot and he does lots of good things, but for how much he is being paid the Kings are unlikely to resign him to play C3 or C4. With Schenn and Lokti coming up and a possible move to fill C2 now it looks like Stolls days may be numbered. It does mean he is not a great player, he may just may not be what the Kings need. I agree he plays with heart and is a good 2 way player, great on faceoffs. Eric Belanger is a great 2 way center who plays with grit and is a faceoff expert, he is an UFA and made $800,000 last year not 3.5 mil. Heart, grit, and faceoffs can be had for a lot less money.
Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 12:59 pm
@Dave, No Vinny Prospal was the #2 Center. Brad Richards was the #1 left wing, who switched with Prospal depending on match ups. He primarily payed Left Wing. He also switched to #3 Center as well.
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Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:54 pm
@Dominick, sure, Richards could play LW. but DL wouldn’t give him $7M+ to play wing. the Kings rely heavily on their centers and there is no way they would pay Richards that much money and put him on the wing.
and again, i like Stoll. but if Richards comes to L.A. i don’t see any way the Kings would keep Stoll. he’ll make too much to play #4 center and unless they plan on moving Schenn to wing there won’t be a place for him in 2012-13.
but that is only if Richards comes to L.A. which is a big if.
Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 2:12 pm
@Dave, DL wouldn’t pay 7 mill for a #2 center. He would pay 7 mill for a #1 left winger who can take Kopi over the top, and make that line one of the most elite lines in the NHL. Stoll isn’t going anywhere, so where do you propose they stick him? #3 center?
Here’s something that I do see TM saying “Let’s play Schenn out of position, like we did with Lokti, because the rsults will be different this time”.
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Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 2:25 pm
@Dominick, why not pay $7M for a #2 center. DL is already on record saying he is about the middle of the ice. build from the back end out and up the middle.
Crosby/Malkin
Datsyuk/Zetterberg
Sedin/Kesler
Thornton/Couture
Richards/Carter
Stamkos/Lecavalier
Toews/Sharp
Krejci/Bergeron (Savard)
don’t all the contenders have a terrific #1/#2 punch up the middle?
and btw, he didn’t pay $7M for a first line LW – some guy named Ilya.
Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 3:13 pm
@Dave,
Stoll is no push over, and Schenn or Lokti are going to be here as well. If you don’t see Stoll being a legitimate center, than the debate is pointless, because the only thing that kept Stoll from being a 50 point guy this season was his wingers finnishing better.
If he improves with 5 more goals, and 5 to 7 more assists, we have a center that can score 55 points. If Penner can improve playing with Brown and Stoll, that gives us a completely solid top 2 scoring lines. Better than putting Schenn or Lokti on left wing, and thinking it will be different this time.
and BTW, he didn’t pay $7M for a #2 C either. In fact he hasn’t payed $7M for anybody.
Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 5:01 pm
@Dominick, no one said Stoll is a pushover, certainly i didn’t. i said he’s not as good as Richards and Schenn is more than likely the future at the #3.
he did pay $6.8M for a center and the cap has gone up significantly since then. he’s also invested a top-5 pick in a center (Schenn) and not a wing.
Stoll is a fine player but he’s not a legit #2. he doesn’t fit in with the list above. he’s a perfect #3. if DL doesn’t sign Richards then i don’t see a reason why Stoll couldn’t stay with the Kings in the future as a #3 behind Kopitar and Schenn and fill the #2 until Schenn is ready.
your statement was that he would pay $7M for a winger – there is absolutely no evidence to support that. he offered Kovalchuk a little over $5M and i’m not sure we’ll see another scorer like IK come available any time soon. why pay Richards $7M to play LW when he could have had Kovalchuk for that?
but there is evidence to support DL paying for a center, even a number 2. he has a top 5 pick invested in a center after already having a #1. he clearly covets d-men as he keeps acquiring them even though he already is loaded there. DL has a philosophy and he is sticking to it.
Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 7:28 pm
@Dave,
My comment was more about DL paying big money for a 1rst line player, not a 2nd line player. Center is our deepest position at the forward position, but left wing has been a weakness for years. Playing a rookie at your top left wing positions when you don’t have to (especially when their not even experienced as left wingers at any level) is not only foolish, but just prolongs the weakness there. I shouldn’t even try to make sense here, because I’m sure TM would see it the same way you do.
It’s all hypothetical anyways. 1rst we’d have to get Richards.
Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 8:24 pm
@Dominick, Penner would be the first line LW so that’s not an issue. he was brought here to play with Kopitar and there’s no reason to think he will be anywhere else.
so pairing up Richards and Brown (hypothetically) makes sense to me. you could put Parse on the left side, you could put Richardson there, maybe he trades Martinez for a LW.
again, DL’s philosophy is strength up the middle. everything is built around that. and if we are so strong up the middle, why did we struggle so much w/o Kopitar in the lineup? center is the lynchpin to this team both offensively and defensively and adding a strong #2 center would do much more for this team than adding a pure goal scoring wing.
BobKnob Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 5:07 pm
@Kaiser Soze,
Neither player is really going to care what their line number is, as long as they aren’t playing with Westgarth or some crap like that. imo.
I think it’s a non issue.
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Like I have said before. I have zero hopes of getting an impact top 6 forward(s) via UFA. Trade, perhaps, but DL strenghts don’t seem to be in getting impact players via UFA or trades. Just going to hope for Schenn and Lok to step up.
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mrbob25 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:41 am
@KC23,
Agreed. Again.
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Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:49 am
@KC23, DL has never been in a position where he had the green light to go get someone and the right player was available. Kovalchuk was not the right player and you could tell by the offer that DL made. Hossa was too early. I’m not saying DL will get Richards, but the scenario seems to be perfect. It’s just a matter of what Richards wants. the two teams I keep hearing (Toronto and New York) have a lot less talent and are further away from seriously contending.
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Garrett Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 9:55 pm
@KC23, @FKA PakiFro, I keep trying to tell people…. We over value our players and the ease at which a deal can be pulled off! Unless you are putting Doughnuts on the table, guys like Parise are simply out. Cry all you want about how DL would never do that, but when you say he will never trade DD, you are also saying we will not make a move for a fourth goal scorer – case closed.
Open your minds for jus a moment and realize that if we put DD on the table, a buffet opens…
Now, everyone say I’m nuts, fine. But then kiss any major move bye bye. And for the record, add Bernie to the mix and you can really lock up some offensive talent, plus signing Richards. That s a cup contender tomorrow.
You can’t get something for nothing, tis my only point.
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Osaka Reply:
June 22nd, 2011 at 12:09 am
@Garrett, We understand you need to give up quality to get quality, point taken. Is DD the only quality player we have? Pick another player because DD isn’t going anywhere. Have you listened to DL? Top 4 D, goalie, and top 2 centers are what he wants to build around. He will not trade DD for a winger. A winger is like a RB in football, just an interchangeable part. Since he builds down the middle I can see him adding a C2, and giving up quality to get it if need be. Just pick another player, it is not DD, no matter how much you think he is overrated. The rest of the hockey world knows he is a real talent.
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Hopefully, Kopi bounces back from the injury. Hopefully, Drew commits to an offseason training program. Hopefully, the kids continue to improve. Hopefully, Penner unscrews his head from his…gets a heart and stops being the tin man.
I don’t have any hope of landing any large name free agents since no one seems to seriously want to be here and DL isn’t going to be paying over his budget for one.
PP scoring MUST improve. Had they been simply as good as the prior season, they would have been seedd higher and maybe the playoffs run would have gone into the second round.
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tuan jim Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 12:06 pm
@vplaza,
No matter how much everybody fussed about our anemic power-play during the season, it was quite effective in the playoffs. (Yes, I’m aware that it failed to produce at the one time when we most needed it to — in game 6.)
Seems to me the same thing was true last year as well. There was a lotta crabbing about the PP, then it took off in the post-season.
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Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 12:52 pm
@tuan jim, Does that mean there’s nothing wrong with it?
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BobKnob Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 5:23 pm
@Dominick,
Yep, some people don’t realize how much of a role variance plays in hockey. One 6-game playoff series is a lot further from the long run than an entire season.
If you are going to answer Dom’s question solely by looking at stats, you will drive yourself crazy and never find anything out about the power play because of how much variance can influence the results.
It seemed to me, by actually watching the game, that the power play was a bit better in the playoffs (but not what the percentages say), but often still had the same frustrating problems as we had in the regular season.
vplaza Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:17 pm
@tuan jim,
The fact is, they scored fewer PP goals this year than last year. Considering their record when they scored PP goals, had they scored the same amount, it’s likely that they wind up with more points for the regular season, a higher seeding, etc. Things that could have made a difference in the first round at least.
They may have gotten a few more goals on PP during the playoffs, but the reality is, they need to improve that during the regular season to put themselves in a better position at the end. Hoping that they get hot come playoff time is not a strategy, IMHO.
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tuan jim Reply:
June 22nd, 2011 at 12:45 am
@vplaza,
Of course, all you guys are right. Our PP does need to get better.
But while it’s good policy to rank as high as you can when you enter the playoffs, I don’t think we were really hurt by the seeding on this particular occasion. Frankly, I thought we had as good a chance to beat the Sharks as to beat any other team we might have faced.
But I don’t think we lost to the Sharks for the reasons that are continually being brought up on this website: We didn’t lose because of a Kopi-less failure of our offense. We didn’t lose because our power-play was inept (except for the crucial sixth game loss).
We lost a series we should have won because of a failure in precisely the area where we least expected to have any problems — 5-on-5 defense. And because we got a little too high-on-life when we should have been keeping our noses to the grindstone.
He sounds like he’s going to be aggressive about adding offense but I’m not holding my breath. There truly is not a lot available on the free agent market in that regard. So absent Richards, we’re looking at a trade which obviously does not materialize out of thin air. It will be intersting and hopefully the outcome will be fun and enjoyable.
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I think some fans fail to understand this part – “Like I’ve always said, you can’t just snap your fingers and get the right player.”
It’s better to make no move, than to make the wrong move. I still think the Penner trade was the right idea, but the fact that he was the best option available at the time shows how hard it really is to get the “right” player.
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Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:43 am
@LB,
Right you are. It does prove that DL is willing to stick his neck out, and pay, but sometimes your going to be disappointed. Penner could still work out, but DL didn’t confirm that he’s through looking, by any stretch of the imagination. Unlike what some believe DL is saying here, I believe that he was confirming that he is actively seeking someone. Hopefully the right guy is made available.
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CUP4LA Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:23 pm
@LB, Exactly why I’m not holding my breath. Will the right player ever come along?
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fsd1 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:28 pm
@CUP4LA, not to many of the people here, no matter what he does they wont be happy.
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Garrett Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 9:55 pm
@LB, @FKA PakiFro, I keep trying to tell people…. We over value our players and the ease at which a deal can be pulled off! Unless you are putting Doughnuts on the table, guys like Parise are simply out. Cry all you want about how DL would never do that, but when you say he will never trade DD, you are also saying we will not make a move for a fourth goal scorer – case closed.
Open your minds for jus a moment and realize that if we put DD on the table, a buffet opens…
Now, everyone say I’m nuts, fine. But then kiss any major move bye bye. And for the record, add Bernie to the mix and you can really lock up some offensive talent, plus signing Richards. That s a cup contender tomorrow.
You can’t get something for nothing, tis my only point.
[Reply]
Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:25 pm
@Garrett,
Yes those things could be available, if we do these things, but they won’t do that thing, because DL won’t go there. We could get even more if we traded Kopi, and his busted leg. Quick and his softside freebee’s could fetch us a heap of stuff. Brown is probably at his highest bluebook value ever. JJ and his +/- infinity -1 could fetch us a 40 gaol scorer.
These are core players, and even though you want to think of the possibilities, I just don’t believe it will happen. Your one major obsticle is that you might feel it’s a sound outside the box aproach, but DL is in your way, and he’s the one you’ll probably have to convince more than any of us fans.
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Osaka Reply:
June 22nd, 2011 at 12:14 am
@Dominick, He copied and pasted his same post several times, hahaha.
Good post Dom.
DL can say everything or nothing in a couple of paragraphs however none of us will really know what’s going on until we’re there in the room with him. So at this point we can all only speculate what’s really happening with the wheeling and dealing and take Deano’s words for what they’re worth. Everyone here knows what we need especially Dean and I’m sure he’ll do everything in his GM power to do it.
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I haven’t seen or heard much discussion as to what Gretsky will end up doing but I thought I heard he may want to coach again. I know he had a young team that was building in Phoenix and didn’t have much success but does anyone think he would ever take over the job here? Just throwing it out here to see what everyone thinks…..I think he would want to help bring LA our first cup!
~ GO KINGS GO
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Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:52 am
@boxtime17,
I think he could fix the PP, but I don’t think he would ever take an assistants position. It would be head coach or GM, nothing less. I think he could benefit from coaching under Murray, who is a very good defensive minded coach. It might even open up his resume a little to see some time coaching in a puck management system. Maybe even help him to develope a hybrid of possesion, and management, that could be used together.
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number 6 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:26 pm
@boxtime17,
Gretz had one gift in life and that gift was somewhat reasonable….. to be probably the greatest player to ever play the game. To do the same as a coach…. he just doesn’t seem like a coach to me. How many truly great coaches were also great players? There may have been, but personally I can’t think of even one.
Look at the ‘hockey careers’ of Al Arbour, Scotty Bowman, Dan Bylsma, Fred Shero. Not sublime to say the least.
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BobKnob Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 5:28 pm
@number 6,
I think Gretzky would do just fine as a tactician, since he understands the game better than most people (he is talented, but I wouldn’t say he had the most raw talent of all the greats, he studied and knows the game better than others). I don’t know about his personality, or how much of a motivator he is, but I’m sure it couldn’t be too bad since he is the GOAT and players will respect that and listen to him.
I think he’d be a fine coach, and he’d be a decent draw for fans too.
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…yawn. If DL ever published a book you’d probably run outta breath reading it.
Don’t get me wrong I’m a Lombardi supporter just not a Lombardi-interview supporter
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Main Problem = TM
Do something about that Deano.
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fsd1 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:28 pm
@Rob, main problem is posters who think TM is the problem. Sign him for 3 more years DL!
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Osaka Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 7:45 pm
@fsd1, I don’t think it is a problem with the Kings, but man it gets old here doesn’t it. Just painful. Lock him up Dean!
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I take it “abatable” was supposed to be “available.”
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Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:07 pm
@What’s the frequency, Kenneth?,
Noun 1. abatable nuisance – a nuisance that can be remedied (suppressed or extinguished or rendered harmless).
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DL’s answers don’t always make sense… In TM’s system, the 1st & 3rd lines get more minutes than the 2nd line, so if Schenn were to make the team, he’d likely be playing less than 20 minutes a game, but on a scoring line. 2nd unit power play, but no time on the penalty kill. Logan Couture, anyone…?
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number 6 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 1:28 pm
@InfaN8,
Logan Couture? What do you have in mind…. a freebie from SJ? Or an offer sheet (which DL would never ever do)?
Or trading Doughty or Kopi to get him?
[Reply]
InfaN8 Reply:
June 22nd, 2011 at 1:20 pm
@number 6, No. I’m saying Schenn has the talent to fill the same role Couture does in SJ…
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This isnt impossible like Deano is making it. Of course there is not one huge guy out there you can always get. When you miss out on Kovalchuk, you dont sit on your thumbs saying “well, no one else is out there like him, so what can we do?” Obviously Richards is available now, and hed be the biggest help. But hes older than Kovalchuk, so you cant really give him the same type of frontloaded deal. Regardless, if theres a way to get him, especially with the cap going up, Im all for it.
However, if Deano cant pull that off, he cant act like there are no options. He cant just sit around waiting for the perfect guy. There probably wont just be one guy. What you have to do is go with a couple skill guys instead of that one great guy. For example, last trade deadline, Cory Stillman was available. Thats a really underrated, most importantly really cheap, player you can get that will help your powerplay, your speed, your skill level as a team, without taking anything away.
This offseason, you have a few options too. Alex Tanguay is one of the best passers in the league. That alone is valuable, but he’s also very quick, with very good hands, and good hockey sense. 3.5 million for someone like him is a very good deal. A top line of Penner, Kopitar, Tanguay, that’s a line that has everything. It also has two upper echelon passers. Penner, Kopitar, Leino would be very good too.
The point is, instead of Kovalchuk or Richards at 7 mil per season, if you cant get one of those guys, you can get 2 guys at 3.5 per season instead. Leino and Tanguay improves your skill level a lot. Maybe it’s not as good as Richards or Kovalchuk, but it’s way better than adding nothing because “the right guy isn’t out there.” These are two very good, creative players with good speed and high skill level. They would compliment the two-way players already on the team, help the depth, help the powerplay (especially Tanguay, a genius on the powerplay), and all for very fair affordable prices (that you don’t have to frontload either).
In fact, just Tanguay, by himself, would be a great move if for no other reason than the powerplay. Right now teams can key on Kopitar, but if you add Tanguay, there’s nothing they can do. Doughty would probably hit 25 goals sneaking backdoor on the powerplay getting passes from Tanguay. Everyone would be made better because he makes his teammates better. He gets them the puck. He sees everything. He creates high quality scoring chances out of nothing with his passing.
So that’s something Dean could do. He threw out that type of money on Ponikarovsky last year (back when Tanguay was really, really cheap), so why not this year, except for someone who is a skill guy? That’s what’s so frustrating. Even though he missed Kovalchuk, there were still options last summer. He could have signed Tanguay for 2 million, a bargain, but he didn’t. I think that proves that it’s not always that there isn’t anyone out there. A lot of the time he’s just not a good enough GM or talent scout to see what’s out there.
Regardless, there’s no excuse this summer. Cup is there for the taking this year. Kings need to be at the cap this year, adding like crazy.
My thoughts on Smyth: If there’s any way to trade him to Edmonton, you have to. You worry the kings dressing room, the young guys taking over the asylum, but if thats really happening, its a whole different problem the Kings need to address, and it would happen anyway, even with Smyth. He might be a godo player for Edmonton, but the Kings need speed. Hes got such a bad cap hit and hes so slow, if you can get rid of him for nothing, you do it. If you can package him for Hemsky, assuming hes healthy, Hemsky is another option in the mold I just described. Hell probably be in the same level as Leino and Tanguay because i doubt he’ll be at top speed due to his health, but if he is 100% healthy and in good shape, he’s better than those two actually. A Penner – Kopitar – Hemsky line would be one of the most interesting. unique, amazing lines in the NHL. If theres a way, and you can be confident in his health… man, would love to see that.
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Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 2:34 pm
@Dillix, the problem with Tanguay is he is too reliant on a star player to produce. he can’t be a go-to guy like Richards can. Richards makes our 2nd line better, Tanguay doesn’t.
but i see what you are saying in general. DL added a guy that wasn’t the perfect fit (Penner) but because he knew it was time to start adding scorers. i think with everything DL is saying that he is going to do something. i’m hoping for Richards but we’ll see.
and i would much, much rather Richards than Hemsky.
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Dillix Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 7:06 pm
@Dave, oh i agree 100%. Would rather have Richards than Hemsky, ALTHOUGH, Richards being a top player is very reliant on him being in shape. He has just enough speed and all that to let his other skills come to the forefront and make him an elite player when he’s in good shape. But when he slacks just a little bit, you saw that a couple seasons ago. it changes everything. But Im sure at least for the next couple years, he would be great, so Im all for it. As for Hemsky, he is really underrated when he’s healthy. But it doesnt seem like he will be, at least not for a prolonged period of time. Still, like Penner, hes a top line potential player with more of a 2nd line players cap hit, so I would take that calculated risk. He just brings such a unique dynamic.
As for Tanguay, there I dont agree. I thought he really elevated Iginla this year, not necessarily the other way around. Again, I think he also slipped for a few seasons, maybe got lazy, and people think hes reliant on a great player now. I dont think thast it. I just think he got motivated again and he got back to his old quick self. He got the step back. I think he would make the 2nd line better, but the point would be the powerplay, if not the top line and the powerplay. Either way, even if he didnt play with Kopitar and Penner (who he would definitely help), Simmonds, Williams, Smyth if he stays, Stoll, these are all guys who could be helped by a playmaker like him (and Tanguay is really good at finding the trailer, or the backdoor, so he would especially help the offensive defenseman, especially Doughty).
Im not saying hes the perfect fit, but if its between Tanguay at 3.5 or even 4 million (the likely ceiling of what he would get from anyone), and no one, or between Tanguay at that price, without having to give up any assets, or forcing a trade for someone at the same price who’s not even better than he is, and havig to give up more prospects, I say Tanguay. Or Leino. I like Leino a lot too, and hes a little bigger, a little more versatile maybe, to your point.
I just want Deano to add more skill. Even if he gets Richards, I think you still want at least one more skill guy, Richards can only play on one line. You still need more speed and creativity on the 2nd line.
But more likely they dont get Richards, in which case my base point was just, if you cant find the perfect 7 mil guy, dont sit on your thumbs. Go and get two 3.5 mil guys instead.That helps the depth more anyway.
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Dave Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 8:45 pm
@Dillix, i agree with your overall premise – DL needs to do something and i think he knows that.
i’m not sold on Hemsky, especially given the Kings’ game. the Kings need a #2 center more than a strong winger. i believe that is the #1 priority.
i think Schenn has the potential to be a good #2, but he’s probably at least 2-3 years from being that. i could be wrong on that, but based on what i saw last year i just don’t see him being an impact player at 20. but i think with one full year in the AHL he’d be ready for a job as the #3 and then go from there.
i could be dead wrong on that and in some ways i hope i am. i’d love Schenn to make the team and have a Couture type of year. but realistically his best bet is to play a year in the AHL or possibly play as a wing with the Kings. the Kings ask a ton from their centers and i just don’t think Schenn could handle it right away.
i’ve never been a fan of Tanguay. i’d rather take a shot at Leino as he’s younger and i don’t think we’ve seen the best from him yet. i think he has a lot more skill still left to show. he hasn’t been given a prominent offensive role yet.
and i tend to think it’s Iginla that made Tanguay as he did the same thing with Cammalleri and then Cammalleri got a huge contract and he hasn’t duplicated it since. you could say the same thing about Conroy and a few other players he has played with. that doesn’t mean Tanguay isn’t a good player, i just think he’s coming off a good year and someone will have to overpay for him.
but we are in total agreement that the goal this summer is to add some skill.
my wish list is simple…
#1 – re-sign Doughty – 10 years @ $52.5M should do.
#2 – sign Richards – 7 years @ $50M
#3 – sign Leino – 3 years @ $10M
#4 – re-sign Simmonds – 3 years @7M
#5 – re-sign Lewis, Richie and Martinez to one-year tenders
that would put us at around $63M and we’re good to go.
can anyone say ERIC COLE?
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masterhans Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 3:00 pm
@masterhans, or simone gagne?
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tuan jim Reply:
June 22nd, 2011 at 12:58 am
@masterhans,
He’s a money player and I love him.
But DL has already put his faith in a lotta character guys who’ve played hurt the past coupla seasons. Why lay out $5-mil per year on another one in his thirties — especially if we’re nosing around Brad Richards’ pants and Gagne was a hole in the ice before playoffs began?
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By everything that I have heard about Brad Richards it sounds like his preference is to stay on the East coast. I wouldn’t get my hopes up of the Kings signing him. That being said Dean somehow has to figure out how to get TWO forwards that have SPEED. They don’t have to be big money front line players either. As he stated, you can’t just snap your fingers and suddenly Iginla appears in purple and black.
First and foremost this summer is to sign Doughty. I’m not sold on Simmonds and I would explore my options regarding him. Maybe you dangle a Bernier or a Voynov to try to get a young forward. I feel we could also use a veteran defensemen perhaps with the injury concerns that Mitchell has. Look at Boston. They don’t have start players as forwards, but have six solid guys that can score 20 goals or more and are physical and fast also. Kings are built on defense and goaltending, but it’s time to add team speed to compete with SJ, DET, and VAN.
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tuan jim Reply:
June 22nd, 2011 at 12:51 am
@Hockeysureshot,
Yes to team speed.
But no to dangling Bernier or Simmons.
By the way, even without speed demons we already compete quite well with SJ, DET, and VAN.
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So there is quite a bit of chatter in the interwebs regarding NJ wanting a puck moving d-man….. Some kings fans want Parise…. So if NJ were in the mood, would you move DD for Parise?
Im not asking the likelihood, Im asking if you’d want DL tou make that move.
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Goring 19 Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 10:42 pm
@Garrett, a simple “hell no”
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Dominick Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 11:28 pm
@Goring 19,
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Osaka Reply:
June 22nd, 2011 at 12:15 am
@Garrett, Of course not.
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Also talk of Quick for Statsny… Seems like a hell no, what say you? If not Quick, what about Bernie and another asset?
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PP Anybody? Reply:
June 21st, 2011 at 10:49 pm
@Garrett, I’d trade Bernier and Voynov for Stastny.
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tuan jim Reply:
June 22nd, 2011 at 12:49 am
@Garrett,
Let me be the one to say it: Hell, no!
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Dominick Reply:
June 22nd, 2011 at 7:03 am
@tuan jim, Again
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Bottom line is Penner was a bust. If you actually went to a live King’s game you would have seen how this guy lacked hustle and compete big time. I never wanted this guy in the first place, i was hoping for Hemsky. We needed speed and we got a slow,out of shape,lazy hockey player. Everything is forgivable except lack of effort, and that is what we got from this guy. It is so frustrating because Dean was trying and everyone was looking for some kind of deal to make us better. Let the young kids develop and the future looks bright with Schenn and Troffoli.Let’s not mortgage our future on players who may or may not work out. Stay the course Dean, it has been working well so far.
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boxtime17 Reply:
June 23rd, 2011 at 7:57 am
@King without a crown,
I say we give Penner a chance to start fresh with our team. He’s been taking a beating (and rightfully so) but I’m sure he’s gotten the message and it’s time to see how he reacts. I expect him to turn it around and make a difference this season!
~ GO KINGS GO !!!
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