I saved this Terry Murray quote from yesterday, because I thought it was deserving of attention on its own. Murray starts off talking about specific things the Kings need to do, then goes general and talks about a mentality, a mentality — it seems — of playing without a superstar. Although it sort of sounds like Murray would like one…
Here’s the whole quote. What do you make of it?
MURRAY: “We have to take a big lesson out of this game, a huge lesson. The two points, absolutely, we’re excited and ecstatic about getting the two points, but when we start off playing well, when we’re on the bench and on the ice and we’re doing things the right way and we’re generating the offensive-zone play the way we were, and the shot mentality — the first goal, as an example, is what we want to do — and then we get to the point where, OK, we’re breaking away, and one extra play, one more pass instead of shooting, we have to have somebody — not just the coaches — it has to be a player on a line, it has to be a defense partner, somebody has to recognize that, and immediately it has to be recognized, on the bench, on the ice. We’ve got to get back to the fundamentals, to the game plan, staying on the same page. We’re not an elite team in the league, to break away and have individuals think that they can do it by themselves.
“I watched a game recently with Pittsburgh and Calgary. Crosby, unbelievable play, breaking through two defensemen, holding on and making the difference in the game. I’d like to think that we can get a guy like that some day. Maybe Kopi can break through and be that player some day. But right now, we don’t have it. So we need to attack as five and we need to defend as five. Any time we stray from that, it becomes a concern.”
Paging DL… paging DL, please pick up the red phone.
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Unless……we….got…….KOVALCHUK
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As much as I would like to get Kovi, I just not expecting it to happen. DL has his plan and I just don’t so him deviating from it.
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I’ve questioned this at times myself(my past comments on game reads),and left it at the coaching staffs feet.I think from TM’s comments it’s everyones job,and I like that he’s at least adressing the issue.The more the season goes along the more I like TM.
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I took it that he expects one of the guys on the roster to step up and be that player.
I do think at some point..probably during the off-season, they’re going to have to look to get THAT guy. I wish Kopi would be that guy.
No matter, this team is gaining invaluable experience of playing “playoff” hockey. Every night is a huge night in this conference. The closer you get to the end of the season, each game is going to be a game 7-type game.
It’ll be interesting to see how they react to the pressure.
I’m loving these games as a fan. It’s been long enough.
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I have no idea what TM is saying here. I guess he wishes he had a superstar type scorer. Well so do the fans.
However, I don’t anticipate one coming to the team anytime soon–be it from a trade, free agency or from the farm system.
Cap issues make getting a player like Kovalchuk very difficult. If you spend a lot of money on him, there is less left for the rest of the team. It seems like there is always some team out there willing to pay more (e.g. Chicago and Hossa). Then when the player does not transform the team into a cup winner, the player’s contract becomes a liability and you can’t unload him even if you wanted to. DL knows this.
I am not sure what the answer is…
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This is very interesting Rich because when I saw this interview, it immediatly got my attention as well.
I guess it got my attention because this has been implicit in the system that the Kings play under TM all along. I like the fact that he shared this idea with honesty. I am not sure he is wrong either; any teacher/program manager must play the hand he has been dealt.
I also do not think this is a “swipe” at any of the players. How many in the league can take control of a game on their own? Not many…
With all of the Kovi talk that this post is sure to generate, I will add my two cents and say that, in looking at TM’s perspective and the team’s style of play, I think Dustin Penner would be a way better fit than Kovi on the LW; he is a big body who can bang along the boards in addition to being a great scorer. I am not sure if the Oil want to trade him, but they must dump salary before next year.
Penner already has a deal in place (unlike Kovi) and the Kings could fit him in under their cap. He is used to living in So. Cal. as well. The question remains, what would the Oil want in return?
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I wish Kopi could be THAT guy.
Rich,
take a day off man
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nykingfan:
I agree totally, you beat me to it!
Every game has its superstar… The player that makes the decisive play to decide the outcome. Sometimes that player has the reputation of being the superstar and that player plays to the level of his/her rep. Sometimes the player emerges from the shadows and takes the mantle.
TM says his team must play most nights as 6 players together (I include the goalie) on the ice to get the win because no one player emerges to be super. I think that for any team to win, one of those six must stand out. I think that for the Kings the star varies significantly. I like teams like that. AO is a great player who often takes over a game, but I enjoy watching Washington play less than other teams.
I also believe Kopitar can emerge as a superstar, and I hope he does, soon. Superstars need to grow, too. The Kings seem to be emerging together, for better or worse.
It’s definitely time for the Kings to take the next Playoff Step.
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kozak
I believe DL is trying to get Kovi. Sources say that he was in Atlanta, other sources say he wanted a long term deal, but the GM of Atlanta will not allow contract negotiations before the trade. So DL is basically stuck. He wants Kovi, but he wants Kovi on his terms (not a rental). Atlanta’s GM could be smart here, for example, handshake deal with Kovi, saying, “hey we aren’t making the playoffs this year, I’ll trade you for 6 months for some valuable players that will make Atlanta better and then you come back to a better team that you wanted to stay in anyways” Benefits both parties right. Kovi has also made it known that he doesn’t want to go to NY, or TOR, EDM, CAL, MTL and other hockey meccas because he likes the low press he receives in ATL. Basically this guy likes not to be bothered with playoffs and media, and wants to get paid top dollar, so ATL is perfect for him.
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WWAMD–
So, what does that mean Kovi thinks about L.A.?
With apologies to my fellow posters, L.A. is no hockey Mecca.
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One rumor has Waddell wanting Drew and Wayne. I am not sure that would be worth it even with a long term contract.
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Uh…I thought that’s what we were paying Kopi to be?
Is it too late to get a discount on that $7mill/yr contract?
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“But right now, we don’t have it. So we need to attack as five and we need to defend as five. Any time we stray from that, it becomes a concern.”
That is what the coach is saying. That is what the coach wants the players to do day in day out no matter what. That is how he knows we will win despite a lack of that super star.
He’s not expecting a player to do it themselves. He’s not wanting a player to do it themselves. He wants them to do it together and look to each other for support in all situations.
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If it’s true that Waddell wants Drew and Wayne, he can go thrash himself.
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We have not had a true sniper on this team since Palffy. We have the right mix of players who will drive to the net. The one element we are missing is a sniper. We get a sniper, we could go along way this year in the play-offs.
Pull the trigger on Kovi DL
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jet–
Concur, even with a long term contract.
Atl has forwards and a young defensive corps. For them to make a move with Kovi, even as a rental for rental prices, they will only get one solid player plus two prospects, at the most. No team will trade a superstar to get a superstar, if they want to be better for the playoffs. Atl will not want talented NHL-level question marks. You could throw in a first-round draft pick, or second, instead of one of the prospects–that would be the maximum return. You could add an Atl high-priced contract, with another good player coming in return.
That it, the max. The later it gets, the less the return is. Soon, it’s down to 1+1 or 0+2 (let’s say by the Olympic break). Say, the one could be a goalie…
The Kings do not have enough NHL talent to part with DD plus WS, and still make the playoffs.
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All teams win as teams and lose as teams, not individuals. The difference between making the playoffs, perhaps winning a series or two, and winning a cup, is firepower, but that won’t mean the Kings can stand around and watch one or two players score goals.
In short, the Kings have to learn to play as a team anyway. The “great scorer” is only the difference between doing well in the playoffs and winning it all. Look at the ’93 team with Gretz. The difference between that team and some of the other Kings teams before and after was that they played as a team. Once they played as a team, Gretz’ individual performances often got them to the next level.
So, basically, the Kings have to learn to win as a team anyway, and it’s easier to teach teams that when they don’t have the crutch of a great player or two to lean on. Add the great player to a great team, and make the finals.
This is most certainly true.
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To me this is a direct call-out to Kopitar.
“I watched a game recently with Pittsburgh and Calgary. Crosby, unbelievable play, breaking through two defensemen, holding on and making the difference in the game. I’d like to think that we can get a guy like that some day. Maybe Kopi can break through and be that player some day.”
Am I missing something? It seems obvious both literally and in context to be a challenge directly to Anze.
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I didn’t get the vibe that TM was asking for a superstar, at least not in the sense that he wanted Lombardi to go out and get one but maybe in the sense that he’d like to see someone (Kopitar) step up to be a difference maker.
I also thought it was interesting that TM mentioned “defense partner”. I think Doughty could definitely be that guy. He hasn’t done it as much this year but last year it seemed like he’d try at least one end to end rush a game. I wouldn’t want to push that sort of responsible to be THAT guy on him as such a young age, but he’s certainly capable and it would be nice to see him try and assert himself a little more. He’s great now, but could (will) be so much more.
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It would really stupid for the kings to trade for a superstar player. Having to give up prospects AND core players from the lineup. Lets face it, we aren’t winning the cup this year. Why give up players when a free agent signing will cost nothing in return?
If any LA mgmt is reading this, DO NOT start trading away talent to get talent. In this injury laden league, depth is more important. I would rather have to 7.5-8.0s than one 9.5 on in my linup anyday…
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It’s definitely an interesting quote. I do think that it calls out Kopitar somewhat to finally step up and be that superstar player who can take the team to the next level. At the same time he is absolutely right that they must play as a unit if they expect to hold onto their playoff position. The Wings are going to be nipping at their heels the rest of the way, so this team has to find ways to win consistantly, and right now that is playing the system that Terry Murray has laid out for them. I don’t want to give up Drew and Wayne for Ilya.
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I’m going to echo what Gary Livingston said. Murray isn’t saying he needs a superstar who will carry the team. He’s saying they need five skaters all playing their positions and knowing their roles in the system, which if I’m reading him right, is simple puck movement with an eye towards taking shots when you get the opportunity. If you read Murray’s critiques of Brown, he’s talking about trying to get too cute with the puck, trying to be a superstar…. the same way he says in this quote that trying the “one extra play” or one extra pass” is what they need to get away from.
I think what he’s saying, ultimately, is that he wants leadership from all 20 guys… everyone on the ice and on the bench needs to recognize when they’re getting too cute and trying too hard to be the superstar, and get everyone back on the same page of simple, basic hockey.
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DL,don’t trade for Kovi. I’m sure you know that already, but just making sure…
Sign him in the summer if you want, but DO NOT trade for him. Stick to the plan
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Terry’s quote made me think of something… when was the last time we saw a King on a genuine breakaway that wasn’t a penalty shot or part of a shootout? How about a two-on-one? I’m going to guess that it’s been quite a few games since they’ve had opportunities like that.
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Sounds like he wishes we had some good players to mask a rather dull system.
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@ KingMe20 – Brownie, about 6 games ago, I believe. Before that, it’s been a while.
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Player-X exactly. We need Kopi to be that guy. Bick, Good point about Drew that’s why he was drafted 2 overall. They needs to step up this year like Jonathan Toews did. If those 2 step it up to that next level, superstar level we won’t need kovi. I’m sure DL is hoping its these 2 that become the superstars. He had to decide to build around Kopi to start his time here. It starts with kopi. That’s why DL didnt like brown and kopi’s coments at the end of last year. Kopi will be our superstar it will all depend on him making the jump
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How many teams in the past 6-7 years have won a cup with a $11-$12 mill dollar plyr in the lineup?
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We also need a veteran puck moving defenseman. I’m thinking with Edmonton mired at the bottom and a major cap issue coming up that Lubo could come back on the cheap.
Just a thought.
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How many teams in the past 6-7 years have won a cup without a superstar player in their lineup?
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LITTLE BOY BLUE
HE NEEDED THE MONEY
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JACK AND JILL WENT UP THE HILL
EACH WITH A BUCK AND A QUARTER
JILL CAME DOWN WITH TWO fifty.
awwww good ol’ dice clay. you gotta luv em GO KINGS GO
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If we had a legitimate shot at the cup this year, DL might go out and get a guy like Kovy. But right now, our only goal as a team is to make the playoffs. It’s not the right time to trade our future for a guy like Kovy, no matter how skilled he is.
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DL should bring back Michael Camalleri and Lubo Visnovsky…
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dream trades for a player like kovy would be great. But i doubt Lombardi would give up what ATL. asks for.
i WOULD’NT BE SHOCKED if LOMBARDI GETS A STAR that is not on
the TRADE RADAR OR BEING TALKED ABOUT RIGHT NOW.
DEANO is more connected then a sicilian mob boss.
couple moves here , a tweak there; then bam bada bing we get a 50 goal scorer.
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We don’t need Kovalchuk because look at Washington. They have “gamebreakers”..Ovechkin, Semin, Greene.
What is my point?
I’m not picking them to win the Stanley Cup anytime soon.
I’d rather have a strong group rather than relying on a bunch of goal scorers.
I like how Philly looks, I like Pittsburgh’s centers, I like the build of the New Jersey Devils, I LOVE Chicago, etc.
Dean has built a solid group of players. We need to stay the course and stay the philosophy.
Kovalchuk is not making us Stanley Cup winners.
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crosstown-
the chances and plays that are being wasted by our guys; are plentiful.
the team scores goals by cycling and digging deep with all 4 lines.
our 1st line has with the exception of the 20 first games been missing.
there is not a winger on this team that has’nt had trouble scoring.
Now if we can play everygame and be mentally prepared like the wing game and duck game, we would’nt be saying get kovy.
the inconsistent play and scoring is what we need to fix. I would agree some of it has to do with the mental side; But most of the reason is due to the lack of a quality finisher.
that one finisher would get the lines in order. No more barnem and bailey juggling with the lines.
finisher
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If it’s true Waddell is asking for Drew and Wayne and that’s a big IF the silence on the other end of the phone is DL waiting for Waddell to get serious.
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I think he is trying to challenge Anze…
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i dont think here is someone DL could pull out of nowhere. its easy to see who the kings could be getting a star from.
1) no one in pacific division
2) no CHI, NSH, COL, VAN, DEt, CGY, because they are playoff teams that wont be trading a top end player (maybe a lower tier player)
3) in the west that leaves MIN, STL, EDM, CBJ–the only star that could be traded from there who would help is penner
then look at the east:
in the east it probably comes down to kovi lecavalier….
the other trades will probably involve weaker players
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I agree, Nick. I think he’s trying to find out what Kopitar thinks of his own play. Does he agree with Murray that he’s not yet that player, or does he want to prove to him that he IS that player?
As for getting a superstar, Kovalchuk isn’t the only goal-scorer who will be available in the off-season. I wonder if Patrick Marleau is higher on Lombardi’s list. After all, he drafted him when he was in San Jose, so they already have a relationship. We’ve seen Lombardi frequently go back to the well on guys he’s known in other places (Brad Stuart, Michal Handzus, Justin Williams, etc). The only question is whether San Jose will get a deal done with him, and that may be one reason for Lombardi to hold off on making a deal for Kovalchuk.
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and remember when the frolov to OTT, heater to SJS, and marleau to LA rumor was around in the offseason…boy that would have been nice…
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Call me foolish but I would deal Kopi, Frolov, Parse, Hickey picks and a couple more prospects for Penner and Kovi..Just saying
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Those who pointed out this is a call out to Kopi, good observation. I am dissapointed in myself for not seeing that side.
I spoke with a Thrasher fan regarding the rumors and he mentioned that the season ticket holders do not want to start over again. They want 21-22 year olds who are players. He also says many of the fans want him, but not at 11M per year. They do not feel they can afford a supporting cast. Atlanta is in a tough spot. Bako is right, Kovi is a depreciating asset.
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I’m thinking there are two ways, in this Cap era, to build a winner. You buy a superstar for mega bucks and try to build a supporting cast around him. Or, you build a solid, young lunchbox team and present them as the future to a superstar looking for a new home with a bright future. I’m pretty sure DL is going for the second avenue. Look at the recent history.
Last year we were in the mix for a playoff spot, and DL makes a deal for a player who couldn’t even play. Guess what. No playoffs for us.
Who could have imagined that we would have played so well in the first half of the season? Even the coach stated he was surprised the Kings were playing better than expected.
Who could have predicted the Western Conference would be this tight in January? In this season, every team is going to wait and see what happens to players (who survives physically) in the Olympics before any trades are made. Think it’s tight now? What is March going to look like?
DL is in no hurry to trade anyone. Kovi to the Kings is just so much hot air. DL won’t rent him, period.
Lombardi is playing his cards for next year, not this one. Get used to it. If we make the playoffs, great. If not, DL will tell us the struggle to make the playoffs this year was like being in the playoffs anyway and we needed the experience.
If something falls into his lap, DL will probably consider it, but we’d all better take him at his word when he told Brownie and Kopi to “play better” before he’d be buying a sniper.
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Dustin Penner #27 Left Wing
Height: 6-4 Weight: 245
Shoots: Left
21 Goals 20 Assists
Ilya Kovalchuk #17 Left Wing
Height: 6-2 Weight: 230
Shoots: Right
No Kopi No Frolov..How would you like to see this dangerous squad on the ice?
28 Goals 25 Assists
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my opinion on this is that we dont need a superstar to accomplish the goal for this team: make the playoffs. we are skipping a few steps by trying to acquire a superstar.
there are trades that would make us a better team both now and for the future that involve good but not awesome players. a trade like the blackhawks made for phalsson last year was great, a similar move (not necessarily a defensive center) would suffice. a solid 6th defenseman, etc, would benefit this team also while putting us in a good spot for next year
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Kovalchuk is more than likely goin to KHL in the summer… It would be a waste to trade for him unless there is some guarantee of a signing long term.
Waddel knows this and sees his asset price diminishing constantly. I would give up Teubert and Frolov with maybe a conditional pick, but only if I know I can sign Kovi for at least 2 years…
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Murray’s comments make me go back to the Gann interview with Lombardi, from last week I think. I don’t think Murray is wanting more and saying so publicly, his job is to teach the guys he has. But that DL interview was telling. He said he had three boxes yet unchecked. I think one of those three is, for sure, a big shot from the point for the power play. Right now, the two units are very simliar, both have puck movers on the point but no scary shot like an Al Macinnis, a Souray, or a Chara. I have to think one box is that, a big shot from the point to give the two units variety. I think another check box is a true power forward. Like a Penner, a John LeClaire, some guy that has size and decent enough speed to defend but makes his goals by just being to damn big to control his stick. The third checkbox? Most will say a sniper, like he whom I will not here mention, but they don’t come cheap and are not good value. I think his 3rd checkbox is another 30 goal guy on right wing, not the superstar sniper but another Justin Williams type. A real quick guy, like Versteeg, that can fit in lots of slots and won’t forget to backcheck. Medium large, with speed and a shot, that can keep the other team honest. Kind of like what Moller could become if everything went perfectly for him but with a little more skill and size. Moller is a good deal, but a 3 or 3.5 million worth Moller type.
It will be interesting to hear others thoughts, hopefully it won’t become the “get kovi” channel.
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Again very confusing from TM
“We’re not an elite team in the league, to break away and have individuals think that they can do it by themselves…I’d like to think that we can get a guy like that some day. Maybe Kopi can break through and be that player some day. But right now, we don’t have it. So we need to attack as five and we need to defend as five. Any time we stray from that, it becomes a concern.”
So, do you want Kopi to take over a game or not? How can he become that player if you’re telling him not to try?
Quisp, this is what I’m talking about; Kopi is being told to NOT try to steal a game on his own.
Man do I hate TM as a coach.
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I believe to we need a finisher. We also need to make the playoffs this year. I still would like to see malkin in a kings jersey, but now that i hear about penner in all 4 that. we have a older defense mentor to show the younger 1 the right way(scuderi) we have a net man mentor in smyth and zeus, we need a pure scorer to show the kopitars and moellers and parses. just my opinion. ALOHA GUYZ
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the kings are in the top half of the league in goals scored. why is there so much talk about getting Kovi? the Devils won cups without having a superstar/top 5 scorer…our team is so young, so why dont we see who will become our superstar.
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This might sound odd to some, but I wish TM had called out Moller.
Loved your discussion, Player-X. I think you are dead-on! To your words I’d add this:
Moller and a player for the Ducks I had the great fortune to see up close, Dan Sexton, are very similar physically. Small and quick, soft hands and very very young, Sexton has made the move from AA Bakersfield to the NHL by keeping his motor running constantly, by using fabulous ice position, and tenacity on the puck.
-just as I type this, Sexton scores his 8th goal of the season on the power play!-
Sexton has 8g 7a in 25(?) games/ 15 points utilizing this style of play. I believe Moller has the same basic skills, and should be producing similar numbers. Sexton scored his latest goal simply by having his stick down on the far side in the crease so he could make the deflection off a perfect pass.
The Kings are a good enough team to present the golden opportunity to a young player ready to make his mark. Sexton was ready. Where is Moller?
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While it would be a nice fantasy to get Kovalchuk, the more I think about it, the less I like it. Oh, and Drew and Wayne for Kovi. Oh sure, I mean that sounds like a really good deal for the Kings, but if Atl doesn’t bite maybe DL can sweeten the pot by adding next years 1st plus Bernier… PLEEEEASE. This rumor stuff is simply so stupid that actually I can’t believe I’m wasting this time.
I would’ve done better to write an intelligent post like Bako and NYKfan.
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I think kingMe said it right. It is very probable that DL would look to players he drafted like Marleau as that missing piece. A character guy who can score.
Also remember that we have Schenn in the pipeline. He has already proven to this organization he is the real deal. I don’t see the Kings rushing him but of he is ready them he will definetely be on this team next year. I know there is this rush to make the playoffs this year. But if we don’t, this isn’t the end of the world. The building blocks are in place. The core is there and gaining valuable experience. if you ask me next year is not only a playoff year but I see it similar to the Chicago situation without the cap restraints where we can be a Stanley Cup contender with cap space to make the right moves. We should be happy with playoff experience this year but look to won the Cup next year. I will make the call now. LA Kings win the Stanley Cup next year.
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Wow, many opinions out there, and this is what this form is for, so I’ll give my 2 cents.
First on the Kopi not being the Guy we need him to be; TM is making kopi that player. We don’t get to see him on those break aways or have the opportunity to change the game by himself. TM has ben very vocal about making sure Kopi plays against the other teams TOP lines. When we played the Caps how many goals did Ovi have? or with the Penns, Crosby? These lines were Kopis Job to shut down, and also his job to try and score against. He doesn’t have the freedom like other superstars to play against the 2nd – 4th lines. Hes matched against the top lines. But this is also allowing him to play with the top players in the NHL to see what they do and how they do it. You’ll know when its his time when TM cuts that line from the opponits top line. And I can go on and on about how this helps every line but I don’t have that much time. It is helping the growth of everybody.
On Kovi, Stay away, right now we have the cap space, but for the long term? No way. Too many young guys we will need to sign to keep them long term. If we can sign Kovi to a 5 ye 7 mill per year??? Maybe. No more. I would like to see DL go to Chicago in the off season and make a bid for Kane, they have to give somebody up. like it or not. Keep the core young with veteran experience.
All I’m reading here is now now now. he great and we need him. Yes he is great, Yes we need him. but not at that price or what it will cost us long term.
Stay the course DL. don’t stray, There are guys out there that fit your mold, don’t sell the farm.
My 2 cents. Thanks guys…
GO KINGS…
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Sorry, one more thing, this Drew + player x thing is crazy… Were talking about one of the best D-men in the NHL at 20 years old… it makes me laugh, DL is brilliant when making trades, His response would be more like; “Drew and his salary for Kovi and his crazy terms and a 2nd… DD IMHO is untouchable.
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i think every devote king fan would prefer to stay the course.
have the players pan out to what they’re expected to become.
DO YOU KNOW HOW LONG and A BIG ?question mark that becomes.
that will take us years and even if lombardi is patient enough to wait longer. The kings dont have a KOVALCHUCK OR HEATLEY in the system. OUR DEPTH is a Defence and A couple goalies.
So if the opportunity presents itself to acquire a sniper/superstar
you take that chance/risk.
But thats when it gets tricky. What or who are you willing to give up.
LOMBARDI has to asses does that piece get us there?
i THINK THAT PIECE IS WHAT WHERE MISSING.
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Maybe Pheneuf puts a big hit on Bobby Ryan tonight
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The most important piece to any team a goalie.
second i would prefer offense-
-
because even if you’re defense does’nt play well on a certain night, the Goalie can win the game for you.
but in the end these positions mesh together to make a team.
i think a move will be made but not the one every king fan is hoping for.
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And that is the big question. What team is willing to sell the fam for a UFA at the end of the season? Why would we give up DD, Brown, Fro or simmer for a chance to sigh him for 11 mill per for 10 yrs? That’s just crazy talk.
Or we can go back to the way we did things post DL, Trade out future for right now, and not have the salary for a supporting cast. Your right it’s worked in the past for us.. right? Wait,,,anaaaaa it hasn’t.
Your right that this is the piece were missing. Every team is missing the Kovi piece. But for me> to steep for a UFA, make a play for him in the off season if not. there are pieces to be had. Selling the farm for a player that has brought his team the cup for… Wait? he hasn’t. end of story
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Judging from Rich’s interview with DL, a block-buster deal to get Kovi or another sniper of that calibre probably won’t happen…at least not this year. That type of deal would shake up the chemistry on this team and I think we’re still a young, fragile team.
So if a piece came this year, it would be from a team looking to dump some salary this year to get cap space to make “another better deal”. I sense that DL will not make any big moves this year. See how we do in the playoffs, and the bigger spash being made in the off-season, maybe before the draft.
TM is saying that this make-up of this year’s team has got to be team-based, b/c we don’t [yet] have a true superstar…we are close, but not there yet.
If we do well to make the playoffs and maybe steal a first round win, DL will make a major move this summer. He’s got the pieces to deal, and they’ll be plenty of teams with cap space problems looking to make a deal to get rid of some salary.
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I am as hungry for a cup as anyone here. It has been a long, agonizing existence as a Kings fan. While I would like to see a couple of “dead weight” players dealt, I see no need for a fire sale to get someone like Kovi. If they don’t make the playoffs, I will punch a wall and then chalk it up to a “learning experience”. After muffing a couple of early attempts, DL has been very adept at finding the right pieces. He gave Quincey a chance to shine, and then dealt him for Smytty. I am guessing he had the same thought for Jones. This year may break our hearts, but I am thinking next year won’t.
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jet -
drew and wayne. HAHHAHAHAHAHA. Not even for Kovalchuk with contract, Kane and Bogosian and their #1 pick this year. Well, maaaaaybe. No, no. Never.
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Steve s, re cap issues:
everyone has to play by the same rules. the kings have more cap room than most, and certainly more cap room than the usual contenders. chicago, whom you mentioned I think, simply can’t do it without sending tons of salary back, which would frankly hurt them more than it would help (it’s not like they have a goal scoring problem anyway). oh, maybe you were just using chicago/hossa as an example. never mind, then.
i agree with you regarding albatross contracts. i think kovalchuk’s contract will end up more Hossa-like (long term low cap) than Vinnie-like (long term idiotic cap). Kovalchuk at a $6-7MM cap hit is totally doable, even paying him $11MM for a couple of years. And that ($7MM cap hit) is a workable number. Totally worth it in my opinion. Me, I still have questions about his defensive ability, etc., but there is no question the Kings would win more of these one goal games with someone like Kovalchuk, who can finish. The Kings are doing quite well with a mediocre power-play. Imagine them with a terrifying one. In the playoffs, that’s gold.
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Bako, re what does Kovi think:
I think he likes being a celebrity. Therefore, I think he would love LA. However, what does Dean think about the fact that that’s probably what Kovi thinks?
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player-x, re comment directed at Kopitar -
Well, as you point out, he directly mentions Kopitar. But I don’t think it’s exactly a criticism of AK. Nobody thinks he’s Crosby at this point. The comment isn’t meant to put him in his place or anything. That’s not really Murray’s style. Murray is really talking about playing within the system (and playing hard within it) rather than playing outside the system. Instead of “trying to do too much,” the players with superior ability are supposed to use it within the system, to make more room for themselves and their linemates. Sort of “the system only more so,” rather than “the system, except if you’re really good.”
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Bring Back -
As fate would have it, I blathered extensively on this very topic last week: http://wp.me/ptucv-T6
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I am shocked that anyone on here would even mention a trade involving Doughty. He is a franchise defenseman at the age of 20. He is to defensemen what Crosby is to forwards. He is as untouchable as they come.
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Unless it’s long term Kovi is not a good deal for us. And even long term I’m not sure I’d pay that much.
Now Penner might be someone that we could get for a prospect and a pick. And wouldn’t he fit in great with our group of guys.
Lets not go crazy just because we are in the hunt. Remember Anson Carter? Mark Parrish?
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Yeah Quisp, I agree with what you say, too. I wasn’t thinking Murray was being hard on Kopitar, just challenging him. I think Kopi and Murray are totally on the same page, to make Kopi immune from line match-ups by putting him out there against the other teams top line and forcing him to learn defensive hockey. It all seems set up to win in the playoffs; learn the grind game, which can be taught, adding that to the arsenal of a player with the kind of skills and ability that cannot be taught.
P.S.-Read your article, nicely done. I think Kopitar is at 60% of the lesson learned, the same lesson that he began learning last year. The same frustration from last year’s dip in offensive production by Kopi is bound to rear it’s ugly head now and then, but I feel it is a necessary journey, that Kopi is doing well in it, that the team is growing around him, and that the leadership vacuum, which I see as just occasional and infrequent, is being filled this year better than last. Hard to find words, but maybe I can express it by saying we are at about 80% on all levels of the game, most levels of the game we have current potential of 95%, and that if we can learn to combine and utilize the differnent aspects of the game at 85% we would be world-beaters. We are close in most areas, there in some areas, but unable, yet, to just open the closet and pull out the right game at the right time often enough. I’m mixing metaphors, but we just can’t quite fire on all cylinders, yet, but man we got a great motor and the car is just sitting there waiting for someone to advance the timing.
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Way to go CLUCKS! Nice comeback 5-4…..! Come on KINGS!!! Let’s go!
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Bako, re Moller:
I respectfully disagree.
First of all, Moller is TWO YEARS younger than Sexton. Second, last year, Moller’s numbers were almost exactly the same as Sexton’s (this year) when Oscar left to captain the Swedish team at the WJCs. Third, Sexton is getting the ice-time that Moller was getting last fall. This year, Moller is playing with Ivanans. Ivanans.
Sexton leads the Ducks in GF/60 AND in GA/60. His +/-/60 is even, 0. Moller is in the middle of the Kings on both stats, his GA being better than Sexton’s but not by much; Sexton’s GF60 is 2-3 times Moller’s, but, again: Ivanans. Ivanans.
But here’s the most important stat: “Quality of Teammates” or QUALTEAM. This measures, just like it sounds, how good the players are who are on the ice with you. Sexton’s QUALTEAM (+0.467) is the highest on the Ducks. In fact, his QUALTEAM number is 10th in the entire LEAGUE. Moller’s is -.322, second to last in front of Segal. So, Sexton basically couldn’t be surrounded with better players, and Moller, well…
Ivanans.
Not to pick on Ivanans. But, come on.
Sexton is having a great season so far, just like Oscar did last year. And like the Kings last year, the Ducks have holes which Sexton can fill.
Bottom line: I don’t think there’s anything to call out Moller about. But I’m with you, he needs more opportunities. He’s working his *** off with Raitis, and that’s all you can ask.
p.s. the true snipers in the Kings organization are Moller and Loktionov. Neither one of them is getting dealt. (or I will immediately buy a jersey with their name on it of whatever team they get dealt to.)
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Hey Quisp – what of the Souray rumors? Anything to them?
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well said WTF Kenneth?!
The responsibility has been completely placed on the players, from the recognition to the completion…
A superstar, sure he wants one, who wouldn’t, but until then……. A superstar is FAR MORE successful in a consistent system anyway. We can’t as a team just go through the motions until we get one and then expect them to do it all. And even then no superstar can do it ALL night in and night out. So we need to get our basic system habits down so that when we do get that guy we’ve got the system in place to “support” that player and we’re a complete team TOGETHER, no matter who shows up on the score-sheet more…
Kopitar may get there someday, but I don’t see him hitting that level for another 2-3 years at the soonest.
jet says:
“One rumor has Waddell wanting Drew and Wayne. I am not sure that would be worth it even with a long term contract.”
I WOULD NOT, nor do I think Lombardi would, trade Doughty for Kovalchuk straight up!!! AND Simmonds? He must be drunk!!!
Player-X,
I don’t know if it’s calling out Kopi or not, but Kopi DOES need to get some aggression back into his attack. He’s playing a very soft game right now, unlike Crosby.
badGoltending says:
“i WOULD’NT BE SHOCKED if LOMBARDI GETS A STAR that is not on the TRADE RADAR OR BEING TALKED ABOUT RIGHT NOW.”
I’ve kind of thought this as well at times. Or maybe a 3-way that nobody sees coming…
I’m Just Saying,
you’re foolish!
Sorry, I just can’t lose Kopitar at this young point in his very promising career. And I would also hate to lose Fro & Parse right now (depending on the deal). We have enough youth to make a move without gutting the core. I like the idea of Penner, as well as Kovi, but I’m starting to lean towards waiting until the off-season where there’ll be more available and where I think we can get more for our money and STILL bring in a scorer. Part of my shift is due to what if that ONE guy we sunk EVERYTHING into gets hurt, then where are we? Atlanta’s in the spot they’re in because of money, so they somehow need to lose payroll, not break even, if they want wiggling room. So I think they do need more in the way of picks and prospects…
IceGuy says:
“I’m thinking there are two ways, in this Cap era, to build a winner. You buy a superstar for mega bucks and try to build a supporting cast around him. Or, you build a solid, young lunchbox team and present them as the future to a superstar looking for a new home with a bright future.”
I like your two options for how to do it – it makes sense.
peace all!!!
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cowboy re souray:
Other than the fact that he may be moved and apparently said he would waive his NTC, I haven’t heard anything, nothing Kings-related.
anyway, I have no way to judge these things except common sense. Souray is expensive. We have Voynov and Hickey in the wings for power-play prowess (Voynov I kind of expect to make it next year). Yes, we could use someone like that, of course (Souray, I mean). But it would cut into our cap space seriously (I’m thinking about next year). EDM needs to dump salary (since, you know, they suck), so it would probably be picks and prospects back. That part’s doable. But who are the top four d then? Doughty, Scuderi, Johnson, Souray — and the bottom two or three are Drewiske, Greene, Jones, Harrold and SOD. That’s five.
Okay, I can sort of see it, roster-wise, if you’re expecting Voynov and Hickey (and Teubert and Muzzin) to play another year not in LA. But the money would basically mean that we’re spending our cap space on Souray, instead of [fill in your favorite sniper]. Souray’s not a rental. He’s got a couple of years left on his deal.
If he were cheaper, it would make more sense, but then if he were cheaper they wouldn’t be trading him probably.
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we r under the cap. right? kovalchuk is the guy DL needs in his formula… LW sniper.. what;s the alternative? playing against him? hopefully not in the pacific conference!! He is the missing piece right now in DL’s “plan”. J williams RW will be gone 2011,more mula there too. Time is now..Instant PLayoff contender w/ kovalchuk…
imagine,doughty to frolov to kovalchuk, he scores!! like 50xs a year.
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Folks — I was not being an advocate for trading Drew and Wayne. I was bringing up the cost still early in the game. While I spoke with my friend from Atlanta, I could not help but get the ongoing feeling that the Kings were thought of as easy targets in trades. I ran across the same attitude last Summer when discussing our #5 overall with a friend from Toronto. He was convinced that the Kings would take a first and a third for Schenn. I find mayself continually saying that this is “not your father’s Kings GM”.
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What accounts for this deal-making hysteria?
The Kings have gotten at least to this point because of the unexpected quality of their goaltending, their balanced scoring, and their defensive depth.
Oh . . . and the excellence of the coaching has SOMETHING to do with it as well. At long last we have brains behind the bench who are willing to give plenty of ice-time to young guys that the old Kings management would routinely have traded away.
I’m sick of watching other teams skim the cream off our draft picks and go on play-off runs with people we traded to them in a our short-term hunger to GET A SNIPER NOW.
To hell with that. All I hope DL is doing in Atlanta is visiting the Coca-Cola bottling plant. I like our team and wanna see it grow.
In short, I’ve got more faith in our own budding superstars than in $10,000,000/year Russian fix-its.
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Trip on these numbers for the Oil:
Penner 4.25 for the next three years(about as much as Fro or Zeus make right now.)
Souray 5.5 this year and 4.5 for the next two (too expensive considering Doughty will need that much in two years).
Get this one though:
Visnovsky 7 this year and 6 next. I only bring him up because I know someone brought up his name a few hours ago.
But many are still talking about Kovi for 10 per year, long term? No!! The Kings could take Penner right now without having to dump any salary.
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Quispie–
Your analysis is creating a great argument to focus the Kings’ trade desires on an adequate linesmate for Moller. Who would it take, using your QUALTEAM statistic?
Such a player would likely be much cheaper, say a trade of similar assets, with a line change.
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Penner, Moller & Segal?
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And what do we pay Simmer when we renew him at the end of next season?
Don’t forget how the Oilers got Penner.
All this juggling of line combos is fun to think about but expensive to implement. I’d like a team of superstars. That’s not gonna happen. Right now we have a good hand to draw to . . . and we can stay in the game without laying out too many chips.
What I want to avoid is a team of one or two superstars flanked by a supporting cast of mice, where all the depth it took years to get is wiped out overnight in a couple of under-the-gun trades.
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Bako -
Well, I think Moller and Loktionov will be on the second line together in a couple of years. Until then, it will be about Oscar squeezing himself into whatever “box” is available.
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Tuan Jim,In regards to Kovi I’m starting to feel the same as you.There are so many other options out there that would help this team.This team isn’t even fully developed yet and everyones screaming for someones head.JJ,DD,Fro,Brownie,Simmonds,Quick,Berner,a couple of 1rsts,Hickey,Tuebert,and even a bag of pucks.We don’t even know weather we can even get Kovi for sure.It’s fun speculating,but I think we have the room for options.If we get him fine.If we don’t fine.I hope we go after stealing someone like Rick Nash who signed a contract on a team he thought would go somewhere,and hasn’t.(I’m not starting another rumor for those of you who can’t see I’m being sarcastic).
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Tuan,
Simmer is good for .525 untill after next season. But its a good point:
What about Fro? 4 Mil.
What about Ivan? (even though he is not a very good 4th liner) .6
What about Richie? (gotta keep that guy!)? .6
What about Parse? (really gotta keep that guy!)? .55
What about Randy Jones?(In my book, a keeper as well)3
What about OD? 1.25
The Kings have well over 10 million dollars worth of decision making to do before the start of the season next year (and probably even more than that depending on who comes up and who stays down in the bushes). That can be seen in two ways. This could be glass half full or half empty. Even if they bring up the youngsters, they, at some point need to be paid as well. The ‘Hawks can tell you all about it I do believe.
I guess the point is, the team next year will not be the same anyway, one way or another. And the old axiom applies; speed costs.
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Don’t trade Doughty or Simmonds. No matter what.
Doughty could be one of the great defensemen in history, and Simmonds has done absolutely everything that we need him to do. No reason either should even be mentioned in rumors. For anybody.
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Kevin Y
Agree 100%
But keep in mind, if 99 can be traded, it can happen to anybody.
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I think it’s a challenge as well, but I also think it comes with a follow-up: if nobody develops into “that guy,” TM wants DL looking to land a big name on July 1. We’re nearly at the point where we can make a splash for something other than hopes of a playoff spot.
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My comments this morning were on TM’s first comments about getting away from the game plan and recognizing when it happens,but no one caught it because everyone was focused on TM’s second set of comments.
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I think it’s best to go after a veteran defenseman to replace O’Donnell (too slow) or Harrold (not ready for prime time) with someone like Ray Whitney. He provides veteran experience and goal scoring. You won’t have to give up much since Carolina will be dumping players to rebuild.
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I don’t wanna give ANYBODY up!
We’ll pick up a bit more than a million in space when Cloutier’s buy-out is finally bought off and, after next season, we’ll clear McCauley’s contract as well. So in addition to our existing cap space we’ll get that much more to play with — so long as we don’t piss it all away getting some big gun who may or may not work well in our current system.
On any given night Fro, Ivan, Richie, Parse, Jones, and OD are really putting out the sauce. Every time the guys on this site mention trading them or not renewing them I get wet pants. (I guess the only player we can all agree has shown what he has and it hasn’t been enough is Purcell.)
To be honest I’m not persuaded that the team we have has to be fiddled with or any major changes made. If they can stick it out, maintain systematic play come hell or high water, I think we can only improve.
But Kevin Y has laid out a real mantra — “Don’t trade Doughty or Simmonds. No matter what.” Those two are real franchise players. Doughty reminds me of Scott Niedermeyer and Simmer looks like a proto-Dave Taylor.
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Completely OFF TOPIC ALERT BUT:
At what point exactly did the “Heroes of the Game” stop being Military personnel and then switch to medical researchers?
Not that I don’t qualify the medical profession as necessary and, in fact, noble. But these folks are very well paid for what they do … not quite sure that qualifies as a “hero”.
The military personnel on the other hand put their lives on the line and make a far bit lower wage in the process. … cops, firefighters, teachers even, all heroes … but … doctors?
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Uh-Oh, political. Please, no.
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Tuan
Good point; I forgot that the Kings had buyouts!!
If there is one good thing to say to say about DL is that he has deliberately put the Kings in a position where they have a lot of cap space! He has always said that this is important.
The problem is, is that in order to take advantage of the cap space, it has to be used. And I do not think anyone here will disagree; Parse, Richie, and RJ are all being looked at by other teams. Parse and Richie can both expect at least 2x raises next year wherever they go. The market more than confirms this speculation.
I love Fro and do not want anyone to misunderstand what I say. But if he is not resigned at this point, one would have to assume that if he stays here, it will not be with a raise. This is a real problem because someone else will pay. Even if its in the KHL.
The Kings have good assets but I am really bothered, having grown up in LA ( Redondo, Alhambra, San Gabriel, Northridge), that the Kings organization seemingly always operates on the cheap. Do we need to be like Steinbrenner and buy a champion? I guess not. But spend some damn money, if that don’t work, make some trades, if that don’t work, fire some damn people. What bothers me is trying to do things on the cheap, not in a big market, not in LA.
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TM wants the team to play as a team since we don’t have an that kinda of top end talent. And I wouldn’t trade Doughty for Kovy straight up even if he was signed. This team is still learning and will have it ups and downs like we just had a 3 game win streak to a 3 game losing streak. This is a young team and this kind of experience will help them become that much better.
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DL DON’T EVEN THINK ABOUT DOUGHTY OR SIMMONDS..PERIOD
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just pick up kovi for the end of the season, three year MAX give up a couple first rounders and frolov. if needed moller purcell or azvedo. no biggy. – so worth it
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Matt George says:
January 17, 2010 at 10:55 PM
Completely OFF TOPIC ALERT BUT:
At what point exactly did the “Heroes of the Game” stop being Military personnel and then switch to medical researchers?
Not that I don’t qualify the medical profession as necessary and, in fact, noble. But these folks are very well paid for what they do … not quite sure that qualifies as a “hero”.
The military personnel on the other hand put their lives on the line and make a far bit lower wage in the process. … cops, firefighters, teachers even, all heroes … but … doctors?
Since they are doing the Echos of Hope this month next month it will be back to Military. Plus these people are saving life’s and to some cancer or homeless children they are heroes.
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I’m still irked we never got Gaborik…Guy’s lighting it up constantly. No offense to Williams but I would of certainly taken Gab on the front like instead. Hell, even Cammalleri.
The idea with Penner is interesting though. Hadn’t really considered it, but getting him would certainly help and he is a lot cheaper than Kovie.
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First off, why is everyone saying Kovalchuk? and yes Rich, it actually looked like an indirect hint to DL. He even wants to make a move, cause we are not yet a scary team, average at best.
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Most of you posters here are fantastic. I get frustrated with the haters, but the rest of you educate me and make me think about the team in new ways. Thank you all for that. Hope to see you at the Feb 11th LA Kings Insider suite.
I’m too lazy to go back and find the quotes and give those who said them their due credit (I hope you will know who you are and credit yourselves) but the gems that I have taken away are these:
Kopi needs to get stronger. He isn’t really a man yet at 22, but he gave us a glimpse into what he is capable of, in the first 20 games. He will be a MONSTER as I think Cynic said, when he gets stronger and learns how to use his size, body, skill and competitiveness to embrace the confidence he showed at the beginning of the season. He and Dewey will be our franchise players.
I’d rather have the cap space to sign these younger guys than get a player like Kovi, especially, as another poster pointed out, because I’m not sure that he really has the character that this franchise is built on. At hockey fest, DL and Hextall said that the reason that they passed on Heatley was because you can bring in selfish players that will infect the locker room. Instead they brought in Ryan Smythe, who has been a great leader.
Someone posted a link to the 14 minute interview with DL in which he said a few really important things. One, he said that the Kings have never developed players from within the franchise. He was talking specifically about the goal tending, and we now have Quick and Bernier, who both have the potential to be number 1′s for the next ten years. And secondly, that even though he had to trade away talent in the past and make our team worse, he will no longer do that. If he makes a move it will be to make the team better. And third, he made a really great point about how the team sort of excelerated their learning curve by jumping to the top of the league coming out of the gate, and therefore drew alot of attention to themselves. I think he was pleased by this, but recognized that they had to reckon with the results by stepping up to the challenges that resulted from that. They can no longer hide behind the safety of being a Cinderella team. Their opponents come out hard against them, and it may take a little time for them to figure that out, but it’s a really good problem to have, even if they lose those one point games.
Our depth is amazing. Injuries can take a team down very rapidly ie: Red Wings. When we had injuries to very key players, the rest of the team has stepped it up. And let’s not forget that we have players like Schenn, Clifford, Hickey, Teubert, Loktianov, Voynov in the wings. It’s a great time to be a fan.
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Rich,TM’s 1rst comments were about straying and who should recognize it.TM’s second comments were mixed with his wish list,his hopes,how we should play,and straying.Can you get TM to expand on the second part?
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Sorry 1rst thoughts were recognizing.2nd thoughts were individual play.Paragrphs should have been seperated at”We’re not an elite team.”
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How people can even think that trading Doughty is a good move blows my mind. He is a world class defenceman at 20 yoa, and one the main reasons we are in the playoff picture right now.
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I’ll take the blame as being “the guy” that brought up Visnovski. I didn’t know he was making insane amounts of cash though. Now I KNOW we could get him for a skate sharpener but it’s not worth it for the cap hit obviously.
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Matt George,
The Kings are doing Echoes of Hope this month, so during January, instead of military personnel, they are honoring community servicemen and women. The first game I went to, they honored a cancer survivor, and she received as many cheers as any military personnel.
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Mark 1,
Well Parse and Richie are restricted agents and personally I think unlikely that they go anywhere. At least Richie for sure where Parse may be shopped but unlikely. Unfortunately I can see Moller being traded before those guys. RJ my feeling is that he likes DL and the Kings organization for the opportunity. If they make an offer my gut feeling is he takes it. Even of its a little less money than elsewhere.
In regards to spending money. You have to remember that this is a business. The Yankess can lose every game and because of their TV deal will make money no matter what. The Kings don’t have that luxury. While AEG was losing money (and they lost a lot of it) they had reigns on tight. Also remember that their venture with Kings was for a bigger purpose like to build LA Live. Now that that is complete, and money is coming in, DL has already said he can spend the money. He has the green light and will make the smart decisions to build a franchise. My belief is that DL knows he can build a true franchise which he will forever be remembered for. And I for one support him fully. I’m excited for the future of this team.
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I think Murray is saying ‘we can’t make the playoffs with this team’!
I really think he’s trying to say when we don’t make it don’t blame me!
If you look at the scedule and the way the other teams in the conference are playing, the Kings could be out of it after this next road trip. Not statistically, but realistically.
Again, I am not a “hater’ as many people like to call it. Just a frustrated fan after 40 years of watching a mostly disappointing franchise.
I really hope that all the young guys and gals here don’t have to be saying these things in 20-30 more years when it gets to be the equivalent of the Cubs!
I wouldn’t trade all the prospects, or Doughty, in a package for Kovi. But a couple of prospects and Fro…I’d say go for it.
BTW…Kopi will NEVER be the type of player some are mentioning above…a guy that can take the puck from the red line in and score…he’s just not that good. He’s a better than average skater with an average shot and that’s it. Same with Brown.
Also, someone above mentioned that New Jersey had several good players with NO GREAT PLAYER and won the cup.
YOU FORGOT ABOUT B R O D E U R!!! The Kings don’t have a great goalie this year. How bout bringing up BERNIER NOW and see how good he is. .95 save percentage? Let’s check him out NOW.
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IMO the coach is being honest about things. I’d rather have him be honest then thinking otherwise. The Kings aren’t the best team in the league. Although they have the awesome potential to be. My thought is even though they don’t have that “top player” on the line, some one like Ovechkin, who can make those crazy plays the whole team needs to elevate. It reminds me of the 1980 olympic team. Herb Brooks wasn’t looking for the best players he was looking for the right players. I think this team has the right players. If we can focus every game (which is super tough), I think this team can be an elite team.
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Shades,
I understand your frustration, but I don’t think the outlook is bleak.
Between now at the break, the Kings have 13 games, out of which they basically need to get 16 points. Call it 8-5-0. That’s the target. Nine of those games are going to be battles, and four of them are “easier.” Two games against Detroit are especially important for obvious reasons.
Detroit also has 13 games to the break, and I would call 11 of them tough. Vancouver, 13 games, about 9 tougher opponents. Nashville 13 (9); Phoenix 14 (13 — brutal); Calgary, well they have it a little easier, but they’re 1-6 in their last seven.
So it’s not going to be easy on anybody. There’s no reason to be more pessimistic as a Kings fan than you would be if you were a Wings fan or a Canucks fan.
Basically, unless the Kings plan on never losing again, it’s going to be a very tight race.
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Anyone remember that Colorado team years back that had Selanne, Kariya, Sakic, Forsberg (I think) that all star line up? I don’t think they made it past the first round of playoffs. So yeah the players are important but it also has to come with attitude and heart.
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What Terry Murray means is that he wishes he can coach like Barry Trotz.
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the team that gets one big winning streak from here on out (like 6-0-1) will be in. thats all it takes and no one team will just fall off the radar most likely.
remember these two things: colorado has a high chance of declining a bit…you dont get away with playing sooo many youngsters for this long. and PHX was in a similar spot last year and looked where they finished. bryzgalov is a great goalie but theres no way this team maintains this pace they just dont have the talent.
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Allow me to paraphrase what we all already know…
Andrew Doughty is not going anywhere.
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Stop The Puck-
Unfortunately, what you say about Phoenix and Colorado is probably almost the same thing they are saying about us, except that regarding Phoenix we weren’t that high last year and we don’t have a goalie with 5 or 6 shutouts. I still believe, but we are going to have to do it ourselves, not count on others beating themselves. The bright spot to me is our record so far in division games ansd against the top teams in the league. We should be able to play well against anyone. Can this young team with now-ability and huge potential become consistently good THIS YEAR? That is the question.
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When we are hoisting the cup, I would much rather win it with the guys we developed and with the guys that fought and gave it their all for the Kings. Not some overpaid Atlanta implant who cares more about his next contract than the team he plays for.
He says he does not want to discuss contract with any potential trade target…. he wants the entire off season to let his agent work his magic and get him a giant pay day.
Ever watch the Wizard of Oz?? That’s actually Kovi in the Tin Man suit, looking for some heart…
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I think going after Kovi could be a very slippery slope. Right now we have a team of net crashing shot producing units that ALL work together with good chemistry. My opinion, that is more valuable and will get you further down the road than a individual 50 goal scorer. Too many times we’ve seen a “50 goal” scorer come in and the chemistry gets shot to hell. Kovi can put up the numbers for sure, put he will also require the opportunities and team resources that will take away from the rest of the team. I like having the Brown’s, Simmers, Kopis’, Zues, etc shift after shift keeping the intensity high. If it’s not broke…
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***OFF TOPIC WARNING***
anyone see this yet? ANOTHER Patrice Cormier elbow…
***not pretty warning***
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqBHlA9Yp3I
and here’s one of his 2 from the WJC
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hzeOhL8_9g&feature=rec-LGOUT-exp_fresh+div-1r-3-HM
WHY is this guy still in hockey? I say suspend him for life, before he kills someone, and send the RIGHT message to kids of ALL ages that this will NEVER be tolerated!!!
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VanKings Fan, lol Tin man…
Blueliner- If it makes you go broke…
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John Chang-
then theres the colorado team with bourque et al. that beat LA and won the cup.
Player X-
i think your right but history says theres no way they continue at this pace. the kings dont have anyone that you can say…wow we are in trouble if they start to play poorly. (well, obviously if doughty does, but he has proven himself by now….just like you wouldnt say that about crosby, ovie,etc) they have gotten to this point with the ups and downs…to me colorado and phoenix ARE in HUGE trouble if one or two pieces begin to decline.
for PHX: obviously bryz….he is good but not this good
for COL: mcleod, stewart, anderson, duchene, o’reiley, etc….
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I think coach Murray is perfect for this team now. Never too high & never too low. It seems he has a very calming effect which some of the haters take for no personality. But yet I think he has the players respect so they are getting his point. I think he is a big reason we have improved so much this year.
And at Tip a King yesterday he was playing air hockey with the fans for 3 hours. He’s a pretty cool dude too. Took his time to talk to the people & shake their hands & seemed happy to be doing it,
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Yeah Stop the Puck, I hear you, I don’t really disagree, I was just saying that we are unproven to them…I agree that we have a better chance of maintaining current play level, but they have played better so they would have to falter more than we have.
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He’s also a pretty good air hockey player & he won more games than he lost. If you beat him you got a free McFlurry coupon and they weren’t giving too many away. And it was cool that he wasn’t letting people win either. Thanks coach!
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Shades,I don’t think Terry Murray is saying anything like that at all.http://lakingsinsider.com/?p=3324#comment-40081
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I don’t know why that link didn’t work.Look at my comment right above your last comment.
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Howe9:
LOL I have this picture in my head now of TM totally dominating small, crying children at air hockey. Rubbing it in their faces that he is going to keep all the free McFlurry coupons for himself.
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Roadtripper – Captain or not, I couldn’t agree more. He’s such a good player woith out the dirty stuff, but for some reason he feels the need to do it. He needs the consequences to set him straight. Uncalled for stuff.
Just want to say this has been a FANTASTIC thread! It was a great read! Nice work everyone.
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“Since they are doing the Echos of Hope this month next month it will be back to Military. Plus these people are saving life’s and to some cancer or homeless children they are heroes.”
Yes, and I, for one, think saving lives is a lot more heroic than killing people.
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uh-oh, political, Please, no.
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Yes, that’s what I said, but no one did anything about it, and I had to hear more political BS, so I chipped in.
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I was just teasing, and of course I was quoting you on yourself…
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Figured as much. I would have preferred the whole (off)topic went away, of course, but if opinions are allowed, mine’s out there.
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Dont have good goaltending? Huh??? Shutouts and save %for Bernier in the AHL are nice, but its the AHL (almost the NHL). We are going to value what Bernier is doing against guys not playing in the NHL, over the Olympian Quicker? If not for John Quick, we arent even in the top teams in the Pacific. Our Goaltending is fine. Who was our last decent Goalie? Potvin? For those of you who havent followed the Kings since the days of Rogie Vachon, Whitey Widding, Vic Venasky, Bob Berry etc, relax. We may not win as often as all the teams you are trying to compare us to, but we are a better run, better coached better playing, more promising team than we have been in years. Isnt it just nice to see LA fans pondering the playoffs and future Cups? Bet none of you were doing that even in October of this year.
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Back to hockey, Kenneth, what do you think Lombardi wants when he says (in the Gann Matsuda interview) that he has three boxes unchecked on his desired team roster? I said big shot on point for power play, 30 goal quick guy liek a Versteeg or a Moller with a little more size, and a true power forward that can bull his way around and scores but hasd enough speed to defend real well…
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It may be wishful thinking in TM’s part but I think it’s another motivational ploy. Get it done or force management to bring in someone else.
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Player-X, at the time he made the comment, I didn’t know what to think.
I think he’d like a competent player (sorry Drago), probably a defenseman who can throw down as necessary so he wouldn’t need to keep a roster spot open for a goon (until a year or two, a guy like Blake would be this guy–and he was also your point-shot guy.) I think there’s that winger finisher guy in addition to Smyth. The other guy is probably your point shot guy…we’ve had them before (forgot the name of the guys who played for Dallas for years after the Kings–there were a few, and one even came back for a year), but the Kings probably need to get better in their faceoffs to take advantage of him. Stoll can’t take every draw.
I have noticed that TM likes to put Stoll and Zeus on the ice in the offensive zone on the power play. That way if one of them gets kicked out, as happened Saturday, the other can still take the draw and has a good chance to win it.
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I think Stuart had been that guy too….
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Phillippe Boucher, but he shot wide all the time ehwn here…
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That was definitely one of them–there were a couple others. One of them was with the Stars for a long time, after starting with the Kings around the time Blake did.
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You know what this team needs, a good 4th liner….Someone like..I don’t know Matt Moulson….Imagine if we had him….Just sayin’
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The Kings would never even in a million years ever even consider a player like Matt Moulson,EVER.We have Purcell…………..sorry couldn’t resist.
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My mom passed away from Colon cancer just over a year ago.
These cancer doctors are indeed a cut above and deserve respect.
They’re also well compensated.
I remember seeing my mothers oncologist drive into the parking lot in his Lambo … I thought .. damn dude .. you deserve every penny.
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Hear, hear, Big Pappa!
I have followed the Kings since the days of Rogie and Frank St. Marseilles and — how I wish we had one like him now! — Danny Maloney (still the most terrifying white man I ever laid eyes on).
We’ve bought talent and traded picks for talent, but look at the guys who came up through our system — Rob Blake, Darryl Sydor, and Alexei Zhitnik, whom we sent off to teams that made runs for the Cup. Remember the goalie we traded a draft pick for? Ron Grahame? The draft pick we spent to get him turned out to be Ray Bourque.
Enough of this trade niggling! We’re doing all right, learning a system, sustaining steady play, growing as a TEAM. We have an intelligent coaching staff and a GM who’s looking at long-term growth.
About time! I’ve got nothing against Dave Taylor — every King on the ice when Deadmarsh scored the overtime goal that knocked the Wings outa the playoffs in 2001 was brought here in a Taylor-made deal. And a couple of DL’s transactions — Nagy, for one example and Cloutier and McCauley for others — are still making us lick wounds.
But however tough it was for DL to get to where he is now, I agree with his approach and with his overall plan. And I lo-o-ove Terry Murray’s approach to the team.
How many coaches would have given guys like Richardson and Parse and Simmonds — and even Doughty — the ice-time to prove themselves? When EVERYBODY was hollering last season for us to trade for a veteran netminder, the coaching staff hung with Quick.
TM and DL and MH and BR and RH, et al. aren’t a pack of nincompoops. They see every nuance, every tic, every need of the team.
I say let’s play this hand out to the finish. If it’s our bad luck to be in a conference where 98 points may not be enough to get you into the playoffs, I’m still happy with the direction we’re going.
LET SOME OTHER TEAM INCUR THE NATIONAL DEBT FOR KOVI. Is he really winning Atlanta’s games all by his lonesome?
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Kovi is sick. So is Kobe on the lakers. Lakers are a good team. So are the Kings. Kings don’t have a Kobe. No need for Bernier right now. It wouldn’t have to be Kovi but i think the kings should pick up an offense minded individual for the remainder of the season. Look at how gift Smyth is and all the difference he brings to the table. ANY ETA ON JUSTIN WILLIAMS?
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roadtripper–
That is a horrific elbow by Cormier but i dont expect any hockey association to take the guys priviledges away for anything more than a week. How was that guy eligible for the WJC’s after elbowing that Swede? Especially in an exhibition game.
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Daryl Sydor was the other defenseman I was thinking of, with the point shot, who went to Dallas.
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